Anyone else running into dealers refusing to negotiate?

[esk8mw]

I've bought and sold a decent number of cars in my time, but it seems like more than ever I'm running into dealers of all sorts who refuse to negotiate (even drop a dollar) on used E90 M3s. I'm talking all sorts of dealers - BMW dealerships, other brand-name luxury dealers (like MB) or regular car dealers (like Chrysler or whatever) that may have acquired an M in a trade, and the shadier wholesale dealers. I've talked to at least 5 dealers where this has happened and they do not budge at all (even after I increase my offer to show good faith, politely point out my concerns with the car that warrant a price drop, etc.).

What's the deal here? I never offer more than 2-4k below the list price (on a 40-50k car, for example) so I highly doubt I am insulting them with lowballs. We should be having the leverage given that the new model is imminent, fuel efficiency concerns, recovering economic conditions, etc. Anyone else seeing this?

I mean, plenty of fish in the sea and all and I have no problem walking away every single time (I will NEVER pay list price unless at Carmax or something)...it's just frustrating.

[mosx]

It's an M3, you aren't buying a used Honda. If you don't buy it at their list price the next sucker through the door will and they know that.

[Handy Man]

For used cars the dealer's "list price" isn't as important as whether or not it is a good deal. If their list price is already below blue book, there may not be any need to negotiate. If its over blue book and they still refuse to negotiate, take your money elsewhere.

[Carrozzeria]

It's tough out there these days for the sales people themselves, dealerships put out pricing on cars like the M3 to stay competitive with other dealerships and make their minimum AFTER buying the car for even more than you would think on a trade in etc knowing the next dealership would give them 1k more (or however much) if offered too low. This goes for cars like the M3 though, not just the average any day car/truck.

The problem I've seen when I go is they hire way more people than they need to at bigger dealerships which makes them have to pay each of them, then the sales person you are talking to has to go talk to "the man behind the desk" and see what kind of deal they can throw back, but it's like a bad stock market trade they buy high so keep the seller/trade-in happy, then try to sell low (but still at a profit) to not be undersold by the next dealership with an e9x M3.

You'll find someone to knock down I'm sure, but the dealer game can be tough on these. Depending on if you're trading in and financing, you may want to try private party? Usually cheaper, and when a private seller see's a check ready in their name they budge more!

[esk8mw]

Originally Posted by mosx

It's an M3, you aren't buying a used Honda. If you don't buy it at their list price the next sucker through the door will and they know that.

That's the thing - I don't think people are scooping these up at full ask, yet dealers will hold onto them waiting for that one buyer who will, which seems weird. It costs dealers money to have cars sit on the lot and they become less desirable every day. I've been watching the listings for a while now and they aren't turning over constantly - the listings are staying put for weeks and months at a time. In one example, the dealer had a car on his lot for 4 months and would not drop the price a single dollar. That's crazy. This isn't some exotic, rare car...it's a run of the mill 40-50k car.

[8k3]

Keep looking brother. I had a friend that bought an 08 E92 with 25k fully loaded (to the gills, only option missing was pdc), for 38.5k *last year* from a dealer. I thought that was a good deal back then. He talked them down $1500.

[WWM3]

I agree with the OP. Seems a lot of dealers still want over 40k for 08s and even close to 50k for 09s.

[///mawana]

Originally Posted by 8k3

Keep looking brother. I had a friend that bought an 08 E92 with 25k fully loaded (to the gills, only option missing was pdc), for 38.5k *last year* from a dealer. I thought that was a good deal back then. He talked them down $1500.

Well, that's an e92 probably DCT and an '08 for that matter - that price is about right. The OP wants an e90 and since I bought my car late last year, I can relate to what he is experiencing.

[8k3]

It was a MT. DCTs went for less. As did E90s

[Eurotoy]

Just paid under 40 for 09' loaded E92 with 18k miles, clean carfax and one local owner (CF roof, DCT, all packages) and very sought after color combo, SG/Fox Red. I think most dealers will play by at least a grand. My roommate just traded in his 08 M6 coupe with 60k odd miles for 27k and next week it was on the lot for 34.

[Eurotoy]

I say start at least 2k under ask but I am no expert by any means, usually they will meet you at a grand under on the conservative side.

[thecurryman]

Originally Posted by Eurotoy

Just paid under 40 for 09' loaded E92 with 18k miles, clean carfax and one local owner (CF roof, DCT, all packages) and very sought after color combo, SG/Fox Red. I think most dealers will play by at least a grand. My roommate just traded in his 08 M6 coupe with 60k odd miles for 27k and next week it was on the lot for 34.

HAHA hey i know which car you bought! I was about to put a deposit down on it but decided not too because I realized it didn't have the packages I wanted (heated seats/prem audio). Still though, great color combo!

That being said, OP is deffenetly right. I have been looking at e92 m3s for about a month now. Most cars arent moving. I have seen them overpriced by a few thousand then when you call and ask they give the whole "its a premium car and in high demand" no its a used car that is already a generation behind...

But I have seen prices start to go down a bit, I think dealers are figuring out that not negotiating will result in a no sale or a car that sits for months

[Eurotoy]

Lol small world. It was sad to see no heated seats but its only driven April-Nov so it wasn't a big deal to me. And no premium audio is news to me due to Audi's cluelessness of the specs/packages but I will know for sure once it's delivered! Still though, wouldn't have stopped my decision. Seems I paid well under market with the prices I have seen.

Originally Posted by thecurryman

HAHA hey i know which car you bought! I was about to put a deposit down on it but decided not too because I realized it didn't have the packages I wanted (heated seats/prem audio). Still though, great color combo!

That being said, OP is deffenetly right. I have been looking at e92 m3s for about a month now. Most cars arent moving. I have seen them overpriced by a few thousand then when you call and ask they give the whole "its a premium car and in high demand" no its a used car that is already a generation behind...

But I have seen prices start to go down a bit, I think dealers are figuring out that not negotiating will result in a no sale or a car that sits for months

[vegaseric]

Originally Posted by Eurotoy

Lol small world. It was sad to see no heated seats but its only driven April-Nov so it wasn't a big deal to me. And no premium audio is news to me due to Audi's cluelessness of the specs/packages but I will know for sure once it's delivered! Still though, wouldn't have stopped my decision. Seems I paid well under market with the prices I have seen.

I was looking at that car as well. Seemed like an awesome car even at asking price. And yes, I don't believe it has premium audio by the look of the door speakers. I ended up with an 08 E90 AW/FR in awesome condition with slicktop, no nav/iDrive for under $30K. (private party) I've watched dealerships hold on to these cars for months, but I think they are starting to drop prices somewhat though in anticipation of the new M3/M4.

[reborn]

I think part of the problem is that the new M3/4 isn't out yet. Unless you're one of the lucky few to get an allocation it's tough to buy one right now. I think the market will change in a few months.

Here's a nice video about what cars /Drive thinks will drop in price this year.

[ckortane]

Kind of in the same boat...

looking to turn in my 335is lease but torn with a sense of value for the dollar:
can lease a '14 M5 fully loaded for almost the same cost as a '15 m4 that has $35 less sticker

Wanted to see if leasing one of the remaining e92s at a local dealership in MD was an option - but was quoted residuals in the 40%!!! Um - no thank you - they were however willing to negotiate to about $2k over invoice for purchase - but if I was to purchase most likely just go with the f82 vs e92 for similar cost (or just a small premium).

My fiancé and I have one car that we purchase(hers) and the fun car (mine) - so leasing makes sense for my car.

I know M5 and M4 are completely different cars - but its hard to not think about the m5 considering the 60% residual and aggressive pricing vs the M4.

Decisions - decisions...

[WWM3]

Originally Posted by Eurotoy

Just paid under 40 for 09' loaded E92 with 18k miles, clean carfax and one local owner (CF roof, DCT, all packages) and very sought after color combo, SG/Fox Red. I think most dealers will play by at least a grand. My roommate just traded in his 08 M6 coupe with 60k odd miles for 27k and next week it was on the lot for 34.

You did well IMO. I've seen some M3s on BMW lots overpriced by 7k or so finally drop by a couple K. One example is an 09 coupe with 36k mi that was just reduced from 44k to 41k.

[Eurotoy]

Originally Posted by WWM3

You did well IMO. I've seen some M3s on BMW lots overpriced by 7k or so finally drop by a couple K. One example is an 09 coupe with 36k mi that was just reduced from 44k to 41k.

Thank you I believe I did so as well. To support your example an 08 E92 with 22k, all options w/ CF roof, DCT, started at 44k, went to 41k and was sold at 38,750. This was at a BMW dealership as well.

[///M3AN]

Confirmed with my dealer (and personal friend), they will be at MSRP on the M3/4 but will not be doing a "market adjustment"/price gouge on them.

[positiveions]

Originally Posted by ///M3AN

Confirmed with my dealer (and personal friend), they will be at MSRP on the M3/4 but will not be doing a "market adjustment"/price gouge on them.

It's all relative to the market. Dealers said the same thing about E9x M3. Competition is dangerous, and hostile.

[///M3AN]

Originally Posted by positiveions

It's all relative to the market. Dealers said the same thing about E9x M3. Competition is dangerous, and hostile.

Very true sir...

If I dealer did that to me, I think I would just have to pass. These cars are massed produced, you are guaranteed to have one at a good price if you can wait it out.

[positiveions]

Originally Posted by ///M3AN

Very true sir...

If I dealer did that to me, I think I would just have to pass. These cars are massed produced, you are guaranteed to have one at a good price if you can wait it out.

I would wait. Knowing the next generation C63 is going to be a TT V8.