Getting your deposit back?

[kazin]

I've been looking through the internet for some concrete info on this but seeing as the 1M is a special production I don't know how much of it holds weight.

Long story short, I have put my deposit in with a dealership and I want it back. I was pushed into making a deposit early because my CA informed me that by doing so she would try for a oct delivery. When we got close to making the deposit she informed me that nov delivery was more likely and I was fine with that. The day after my deposit goes down she calls me in the morning to inform me that nov delivery would be impossible and that we would be looking at a dec delivery. For the sake of completeness, her error was from her assuming that nov production means nov delivery, but that doesn't really change my situation.

Either way, I went and tried to get my deposit back yesterday, and to say the least they tried to "keep my business".

I understand a deposit is a signed agreement, however what I don't understand is why I cannot take back my deposit when the car in question doesn't even exist and not a single hand has even touched any part of what might constitute my future vehicle. The only information I have that indeed I will be getting a car is an e-mail sent back from a guy at bmw canada confirming it.

Where do I go from here? Am I in the wrong?

[silvs]

If the deposit you put down was for a 1M, which they cannot deliver, I can't see how they can keep it.

Did you get a build sheet or anything?

[fourtailpipes]

i'm sure someone on this forum will happily buy your deposit from you if you negotiated anything near MSRP for purchase price.

[kazin]

Originally Posted by silvs

If the deposit you put down was for a 1M, which they cannot deliver, I can't see how they can keep it.

Did you get a build sheet or anything?

As far as the e-mail they showed me goes, yes I do have a 1M for december delivery date. Other than that I have no info on whether or not I have a car.

There was a sheet detailing the options and final pricing of the car that was signed by me in order to place the deposit. I'm not quite sure if this is the build sheet or if there is another to be filled in later on in the process.

Originally Posted by fourtailpipes

i'm sure someone on this forum will happily buy your deposit from you if you negotiated anything near MSRP for purchase price.

I don't know what the situation is like in the US, but the dealership has informed me that they are absolutely unable to pass my allocation to another customer as the 1M now "belongs" to me.

That being said if anybody would like an allocation in the GTA area for a very reasonable price then please let me know. I would like to resolve this as soon as possible as this is wasting a lot of my time.

[MDORPHN]

What was the agreement when you made the deposit regarding its refundability?

Neil

[sergeremi]

Right, if the agreement listed a "non-refundable" deposit it might be a little tough getting it back until the dealer says they can't fulfill the order (which means you'd have to wait probably till production ends to get the money back). It is a binding contract since the dealer is ordering a car, in your name, to your specs. So if you back out, loss of potential sale opportunity to someone else because, in theory, they have car being built with options that potential buyers may not want or haggle over pricing because they have to buy a car that isn't exactly to their specs... or something like that.

We all know the situation is different with the 1M, at least here in the US. Not sure how in demand the car is in Canada. But there's a pretty good chance it's a guaranteed sale for that dealer no matter what car they get.

If the agreement says non-refundable, best you can do is appeal to their sense of reason to coax your deposit out of them, if not you'll have to wait till they're absolutely sure they can not deliver on the car and specs you agreed upon.

Are you wanting the deposit back because you don't want to buy the car or you just don't want to wait on the possibility of getting the car only to be told they can't get one for you while other chances you had slipped away?

[kazin]

I'm ashamed to say that while I had asked the CA briefly about the refundability of the deposit, I neglected to enforce it at the time of the action.

Essentially I want my deposit back for three reasons:

1) I was misinformed of the delivery date. The CA made it pretty clear to me that while the oct delivery was not possible nov delivery would be what we were looking at. Then she called me the morning after to inform me that we were looking at a dec delivery.

2) When they gave me the discount that they did, I thought I was getting a good deal. I later found that ATLEAST 72% (Yes, I did the math) of that discount was being subsidized by bullshit fees that I did not see at other dealerships. So at the end of the day I was getting a very normal price, albeit not straight sticker.

3) In my discussions with another dealership they offered me a oct delivery date, and the price is looking to be cheaper after negotiations too. Not to mention the people I talked to there actually knew about the cars they were selling.

[sergeremi]

Yeah... well if the agreement explicitly states "non-refundable" then you might be in a bind.

My guess is, if you can line up another buyer for them ready to put down a deposit matching yours, they might be willing to let you out of it. Otherwise you'll have to wait or just walk away from the deposit.

[Papethova]

The agreement should also have said November delivery. In which case you should be able to get a refund if they cannot give you the November delivery.

[Thibs]

I had a problem getting my deposit back from one of the dealers in Canada... I didn't sign anything so eventually they gave me my money back but it wasn't easy.

[desertfox73]

My understanding is that if you have not received an allocation (production number), then technically a car does not exist. If the sheet you signed said the deposit was non-refundable, that may be a different story, but it would be relatively simple to argue against the concept that your deposit is tied to a car - the car has not been confirmed by BMW (assuming you are still in 047 status), and therefore does not exist, even on BMW's official paper.

[James T. Kirk]

Since when is a special order deposit non-refundable? Is that a dealership policy? My dealership always offers a refundable deposit deal, especially for a limited edition car like the 1M.

For example, say I'm a good repeat customer who negotiates a decent deal for a 1M. When the car arrives, I then bail on the deal. My dealership is happy to refund me my $1,000 deposit as they work out a $10K over MSRP molestation deal for anyone who walks in and wants the car that day without having to wait.

It's a win-win situation for everyone without any need for the dealership to nickel-and-dime its customers on deposits.

[kazin]

Originally Posted by James T. Kirk

Since when is a special order deposit non-refundable? Is that a dealership policy? My dealership always offers a refundable deposit deal, especially for a limited edition car like the 1M.

The problem up here in Canada, or at least what the problem this specific dealership has told me is that if the 1M does not go to its original owner, they must send it back to BMW Canada.

Now I know that's not entirely true as I'm sure people have taken other peoples 1Ms. This has also been verified with another dealership.

A lot of the trouble I've been having has stemmed from the dealership telling me things about the ordering process that has differed from member experiences here.

At the end of the day, I just want my deposit back so I can bring my business to someone who can serve me better. I have been accused, by my CA no less, of "shopping around". However, the issue really isn't price. It's the service that's been provided.

What should I do now? I'm considering taking my case to BMW Canada and possibly seeking legal assistance.

[sergeremi]

Well, if you're going to start legal procedures you better make sure you have a case. Again, if that signed document says "non-refundable" and does not explicitly say that you would take delivery of the car in November, I would think the law would favor the dealer.

Hey, I understand your frustration. And I hate to say it, but you gotta read the details before you sign. And you kind of are shopping around. You found another dealer that is offering you better terms (earlier delivery, better price, less BS) than the one you made a commitment to. And now you want to bail on them before they can honor the agreement.

And I assume the deposit is an amount you can't just walk away from?

[James T. Kirk]

Originally Posted by kazin

What should I do now? I'm considering taking my case to BMW Canada and possibly seeking legal assistance.

Why don't you just consider waiting until December?
Seriously. If you take your business elsewhere you may find the same delay or no allocation at all. The dealership isn't as influential as you may think. You may be accusing them of a manipulation that really isn't happening. No way would a lawsuit be worth more than a few months patience.

[blotto649]

I purchased mine from a GTA dealership and was informed (and have it on paper) that my deposit would be fully refunded up to any point until I spec'd out my car - once the official order was in, I could only get credit at the dealer if everything went tits-up when the car arrived.
Did you spec out your car yet? If not, then I'd certainly get in touch with BMW CA and let them know that you're unhappy.
Also, I don't buy that line about the car having to go back to BMW CA if it doesn't go to the original owner - my dealer got another AW at the same time as mine and the deal went south so they put it on the floor and sold it the next week.

Just wait until December - you'll get less salt on it

[ItsHectic]

Originally Posted by Papethova

The agreement should also have said November delivery. In which case you should be able to get a refund if they cannot give you the November delivery.

Check what you signed, when I signed the papers at home I had my nephew who is a law student read over it, there is an additional clause that had a seperate signature which says you accept that the delivery can be late beyond a month, I signed it although I did not have to, but by not signing it, it covers situations like these.

[MonteCarloM3]

if the dealership can't sell the car when they get it, you won't get your deposit back but i can't see that happening with this situation.
just because you give them a deposit for a car it doesn't mean they keep your money no-matter what. if they sell it to someone else, they have no right to keep your money.
take 'em to small claims court if you have to.

[M3 Adjuster]

I assume your deposit was a check and not via a credit card? Clearly you could contact the credit card company and have them handle. If you haven't complained to the dealer manager I would take it that level. It sounds like the dealer doesn't want to lose the sale. Agree with others that if the car hasn't been built, it shouldn't be a problem to cancel the order.

Since it sounds like you mostly just want the car sooner, then it's not like you are going to lose out if indeed the deposit is non refundable for some actually valid reason.

[szcyxzh]

Oh well, my situation seems even worse. (I am buying a 128i though). I left a deposit in late July without signing any paperwork (through internet & phone communication). Till date, i have not received VIN#. I have inquired the CA. He basically said the information was put in but no date yet, and he will overnight paperwork once he gets the VIN#.

Any clues here?????

[Papethova]

Originally Posted by szcyxzh

Oh well, my situation seems even worse. (I am buying a 128i though). I left a deposit in late July without signing any paperwork (through internet & phone communication). Till date, i have not received VIN#. I have inquired the CA. He basically said the information was put in but no date yet, and he will overnight paperwork once he gets the VIN#.

Any clues here?????

Just be patient it takes time to get a VIN