bad experience with forum member

[nemex12]

after some thoughts and my usual proscatination i decided to make this public.
some time ago I was looking at our marketplace trying to find new ways of spending some money on my beloved z4 and I found this thread from a guy selling some interesting parts like eisenmann quads and carbon fiber mirrors etc. I contacted the guy asking for those parts because I wanted to make an ac schnitzer diffuser I had bought, work with my non m car. I was thinking on doing some custom exhaust but at that point that eisenmann exhaust with quads sounded like a godsend. didnt have the money at the time so I asked the guy to save it for me and offered a 200 non refundable deposit on the item and the guy agreed.
3 or 4 days later I found out that the layout of the eisenmann was absolutely incompatible with my acs diffuser so i explained my awkward situation to the member expecting some consideration as i knew that there wasnt any serious offers on the table besides mine and the timeframe was very short but specially because it was an honest mistake which i tried to correct avoiding any harm to the fellow member offering to buy any of the other parts he was offering instead. but thats when everything turned sour. he lied to me saying that he didnt have anything left but I noticed that he continued to offer the other parts and afterwards it even came to my attention that he was even offering the quads after i sent him he deposit.
after some chatting he gave me 2 choices:
1) buy the quads
2) get 100 bucks in return and letting him keep the rest as compensation for those 3 or 4 days when he couldnt sell the part even though HE TRIED.
i contacted a fellow member who was willing to help me out receiving the exhaust, storing it for me until i found another buyer and then helping me sending the part to the new buyer but my guess was that 100 wasnt worth puting that kind fellow member into all that trouble so I opted to lose my 100 bucks and get the rest in return.
the thing is that after this, my beloved fellow member didnt answered any emails and just dissapeared so a month after i decided to take half the money i gave him i havent got a dime.
what do you guys think? I dont want to give away the name of the guy before consulting with the community. thanks

[Diokaef]

Is it being a long time? if it is I would just let it pass, none of you did anything really wrong, Deposits usually are not meant to be returned tho but I don't know the terns of your agreement.

[SCHMOUPE]

Originally Posted by Diokaef

Is it being a long time? if it is I would just let it pass, none of you did anything really wrong, Deposits usually are not meant to be returned tho but I don't know the terns of your agreement.

I guess money grows on trees in your neck of woods. I say to OP, call out the poster who burned you, let him defend himself and if the turn of events is as you say, we as a community should make a decision as what to do with him, ie ban him

edit:
ps, was this the thread?
http://www.zpost.com/forums/showthre...enmann+exhaust

[nemex12]

ive tried to contact him by mail, by private message and as a last resort i posted in his thread but by now its evident that he wont answer, i even sent him a message telling him ill buy the quad exhaust and he didnt answer either. to be honest i feel ripped off as everytime i give a deposit in a store they let me pick up another thing if i change my mind, which i never do. the thing is, he never asked for a deposit, i offered it myself but then i find out that those quads wont help my purposes so it was an unforseen event so i expected some understanding but he kept telling lies to keep the money which doesnt speak well of the "seller". and he vanishing in thin air even though i told him ill buy the quads make me think that i wouldnt get the item even if i paid for the whole thing so my guess is that i had it easy losing just 200 bucks instead of 1200
edit: sorry shakib cant tell until the community condemns his behavior

[wildag]

If you wrote a message to him, promising a $200 non-refundable deposit on a specific item, then he has every right in the world to keep HIS money. It's HIS money, not yours, because that's the definition of non-refundable.

The only thing you can do is learn from the experience. Don't give money, until you're sure you want it. It's not the seller's fault that the buyer didn't do enough research before putting down a non-refundable deposit.

[nemex12]

it was not on an specific item as i did tell him from the begining that i was interested in more items only that i was meanning serious business on the quads and the mirror covers(i offered the money, he didnt even ask for it so i would expect some consideration as i always acted in good faith and made an honest mistake, how would i know it would interfere with my acs diffuser which i got the day after i sent the money) ,when i saw i couldnt use the quads i tried to buy the covers, he lied to me telling me he sold em so i asked for another items (which honored the non refundable concept)and he told me he sold em all which was a lie cause he continued to offer em to other people. i guess there are three things you may overlooked:
1) he still was offering the items to people asking for em after i sent the deposit so my money wasnt stopping him from selling those items which means that he broke our agreement first so i didnt have to keep my part of the deal
2) he offered to give me 100 bucks back if i didnt want the quads
3) after he didnt replied my mails, i did tell him i wanted to buy the quads and he still didnt appear,as i see it ITS MY RIGHT TO BUY THE QUADS as you mention so he cant just vanish and dont answer my mails.
botton line: there was something fishy in here, but even if the case was as simple as you say, i would expect a little more understanding from a fellow member. if i agree to save some items for someone but he couldnt buy it because he learned he cant use it, i would at least let him choose another item im selling so it wouldnt hurt my business but equally would help the other part not losing money, specially when we are bmw owners which mean we are not too eager to make a dime out of a fellow member. but thats just me, i may be spoiled by the friends ive made in here and the nice and understanding people ive found in the forums (damn ive even found more understanding from ebay sellers than from this vendor)

[MZHammer]

If I was the seller, I would give nemex12 his money back. If I felt like I was getting jacked by nemex12 (which in my world means he was seriously f***ing me over), I'd let him know that I would be calling him out on this board, as well as posting negative feedback. Just my opinion though...

[nemex12]

Originally Posted by iMcanadian

If I was the seller, I would give nemex12 his money back. If I felt like I was getting jacked by nemex12 (which in my world means he was seriously f***ing me over), I'd let him know that I would be calling him out on this board, as well as posting negative feedback. Just my opinion though...

i dont understand u bro, f***ing him how?

[FerRrari]

You offered a non-refundable deposit so it's up to the seller to decide if he/she should give it back. It's possible the seller had other offers he/she had to refuse because you had a deposit and when you backed out the other deals weren't on the table. If the seller managed to sell the items for the asking price then I think he/she should return the money, otherwise it's a good lesson for you to not offer a deposit until you're commited to buy.

[nemex12]

thats the thing, he continued to offer the items he was "saving", he didnt have serious offers in those 4 days. and if he saved it for me why not respond to my mail saying i was going to buy the saved item? in the worst scenario its my right to buy the quads but he wont answer any mails so i feel ripped off

[3002 tii]

how did you pay? if you used paypal, they can work at getting your money back. any transaction outside of ebay has the min requirement of proof of delivery. and if that doesn't go in your favor, hopefully you paid with a credit card and they'll work with you.

[SCHMOUPE]

Originally Posted by FerRrari

You offered a non-refundable deposit so it's up to the seller to decide if he/she should give it back. It's possible the seller had other offers he/she had to refuse because you had a deposit and when you backed out the other deals weren't on the table. If the seller managed to sell the items for the asking price then I think he/she should return the money, otherwise it's a good lesson for you to not offer a deposit until you're committed to buy.

Your argument would stick if we were a bunch of money hungry wolves but I think we are a little better than them. I have interacted with only a handful of people off the forum in real life and it has been nothing but pleasure. People going above and beyond to help each other out. I don't really understand the pleasure in ripping somebody off specially knowing they live in a different country. I bet the seller wouldn't have the cojones to do this if the OP lived a few hours away from him. Too sad!

[Alicate]

The seller's behavior is unethical. By not giving the OP a chance to change his order and purchase other items, he has effectively stolen the money. Business should not be conducted in such a way. Publish his name in this forum. Either, he is forced to respond and explain or he stays silent and then we all know what to expect of him.

[vasaline]

People saying that he should stomach the loss is ridiculous. OP clearly stated that the items were never sold and the seller continued to sell the items even though he received a deposit to hold the items. He could have used the 200 deposit towards his purchase of other items through the seller.

[Foxland]

I guess I haven't been on this board long enough to know the members or how you function but I've been on a motorcycle forum ZRXOA for years, those guys are a brotherhood, helping their fellow members not jacking them for $100 or $200, IMO pretty sleazy and all the talk about contracts etc. is BS, if the potential buyer now finds out it won't fit you act like a gentleman and a brother and return the money, no questions asked...that's why I thought you belong to this forum, to ask for help, get help and information from your fellow brothers....at least that's what I thought this was all about. My 2 cents worth.
Mo

[inTgr8r]

Originally Posted by Foxland

I guess I haven't been on this board long enough to know the members or how you function but I've been on a motorcycle forum ZRXOA for years, those guys are a brotherhood, helping their fellow members not jacking them for $100 or $200, IMO pretty sleazy and all the talk about contracts etc. is BS, if the potential buyer now finds out it won't fit you act like a gentleman and a brother and return the money, no questions asked...that's why I thought you belong to this forum, to ask for help, get help and information from your fellow brothers....at least that's what I thought this was all about. My 2 cents worth.
Mo

^WHS x2

[Huz-Z]

Originally Posted by Foxland

I guess I haven't been on this board long enough to know the members or how you function but I've been on a motorcycle forum ZRXOA for years, those guys are a brotherhood, helping their fellow members not jacking them for $100 or $200, IMO pretty sleazy and all the talk about contracts etc. is BS, if the potential buyer now finds out it won't fit you act like a gentleman and a brother and return the money, no questions asked...that's why I thought you belong to this forum, to ask for help, get help and information from your fellow brothers....at least that's what I thought this was all about. My 2 cents worth.
Mo

In a strictly legal sense, a non-refundable deposit is exactly that - non-refundable. The seller has a right to set that sort of condition.

But to echo Foxland's sentiment, its certainly disappointing to see that approach taken here. I do think though that in the circumstances, flexibility on the part of the seller and a return of the deposit would be reasonable.

[lucid]

I would have refunded the OP in this situation if I had taken his deposit.

Having said that, and as others have said, a "non-refundable" deposit is simply non-refundable if the seller decides to enforce that term. Why is that being debated really? If that was in writing and both parties agreed to it, it is really pointless to demand a refund if the seller has decided to enforce that part of the deal.

If the seller lied to the OP about other stuff, that reflects on him and he might very well be a liar, but that has nothing to do with the deposit being non-refundable. The OP can decide to call the seller out as a liar and expose him to the community, but again, that is a separate discussion.

[MinneapolisJeff]

i guess before offering a non-refundable deposit one must make sure they are going to buy the parts and that the parts will fit

[3002 tii]

Originally Posted by Foxland

I guess I haven't been on this board long enough to know the members or how you function but I've been on a motorcycle forum ZRXOA for years, those guys are a brotherhood, helping their fellow members not jacking them for $100 or $200, IMO pretty sleazy and all the talk about contracts etc. is BS, if the potential buyer now finds out it won't fit you act like a gentleman and a brother and return the money, no questions asked...that's why I thought you belong to this forum, to ask for help, get help and information from your fellow brothers....at least that's what I thought this was all about. My 2 cents worth.
Mo

i would've returned the money as well. i once sold my ducati sport classic on a forum. the guy considering the purchase was an ex-harley guy but really wanted something new/different and liked the black/chrome look. after much debate on his side, he finally commited to a price of $9000 flat. he sent me a $500 deposit.

then he later called and emailed apologizing profusely about how he can't purchase the bike. him being a single dad, his daughter and guilt tripped him about the dangers of riding a bike. he couldn't say no to daddy's little girl. however he did the opposite of insisting i keep the deposit for my "troubles", ie rejecting other potential offers and working with him over a 2 week period. as tempting as it was though, i just couldn't go through with it. to foxland's point, the motorcycle forum was a tight knit group of people despite the large # of members and this was in 07 during the recession. i returned the money in full and he thanked me big time. btw, i remember that f/s thread and recall telling myself "wow alot of expensive parts from a relatively new member... probably best to stay away". op, sorry for your troubles... =T

regarding purpose of the forum to help others with info though, i recently got peeved in another thread by the incessant basic questions asked by a new member. i'm all about helping others here but there's a reason for a search button. use it first before you expect anyone to help ya out, but i digress lol.

[vasaline]

Yes it is non-refundable but OP decided to buy the exhaust but the seller ignored him and took his deposit. How is that okay? Just basing on some of the comments posted I'd think twice before purchasing anything on this forum from now on.

[3002 tii]

Originally Posted by vasaline

Yes it is non-refundable but OP decided to buy the exhaust but the seller ignored him and took his deposit. How is that okay? Just basing on some of the comments posted I'd think twice before purchasing anything on this forum from now on.

that's a bit extreme on the purchasing here... just useful tips.

1. never pay cash / check
2. always pay with paypal, credit card preferably (add'l layer of protection)
3. have buyer post actual pics (preferably with his sign/sn on a piece of paper next to the item)
4. check buyer's iTrader feedback - and contact those that provided feedback
5. local transactions are best

most importantly... (and this goes with pt 2)


6. if it's a high priced item, have him/her list on eBay and you guys split commissions & fees. problem with paypal transactions outside of eBay is that the only requirement on seller's part is to provide delivery confirmation, but contents and condition of item are not considered. so as long as they provide a tracking number and send you a bag of dogsh*t, it still meets paypal's requirements - i learned this the hard way. thats why paying with credit card is helpful b/c in this case, you can have your credit card company back you up since their requirements are more stringent, and they're there to look out for you specifically, not the seller.

(i was hesitant on the details of point 6, hopefully nobody will use this info to hurt buyers)