Square setup?

[1MORELAP]

How many people run square setups here? What size wheel and tires?

Do you really prefer that to staggered, and why?

[KM3]

I run a square setup - 275/35R18 Nitto NT-01s on 18x9.5 wheels. The wider front helps dial out the understeer. Square setup means I can rotate tires and get a bit more life out of them. The square setup came in handy at the track a few weeks ago when I had a balance issue on one of my front wheels - I had pretty bad shaking through the steering wheel, but swapping it to the rear made it far less of a problem and let me finish the day without any issues.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by 1MORELAP

How many people run square setups here? What size wheel and tires?

Do you really prefer that to staggered, and why?

Sure do.18x10 25P 275/35 18's.A 285 on the rear would probally be ideal as it does have a little bit of oversteer in 2nd gear corners but is very neutral in 3rd and 4th gear corners.The main reason that I run square is that I can rotate the tires which reduces my running costs quite a bit.

[M3 Montreal]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Sure do.18x10 25P 275/35 18's.A 285 on the rear would probally be ideal as it does have a little bit of oversteer in 2nd gear corners but is very neutral in 3rd and 4th gear corners.The main reason that I run square is that I can rotate the tires which reduces my running costs quite a bit.

What offset do you have on the front wheels for the 275's and did they need negative camber to fit or you just put some negative camber for the track?

It seems many people dont seem to think 275s fit upfront without a large amount of negative camber.

I actually went 265 up front and 285 out back with NT05's since I use them for both light track (about 5 HPDE's per year) and the rest on street. No negative camber atm.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by M3 Montreal

What offset do you have on the front wheels for the 275's and did they need negative camber to fit or you just put some negative camber for the track?

It seems many people dont seem to think 275s fit upfront without a large amount of negative camber.

I actually went 265 up front and 285 out back with NT05's since I use them for both light track (about 5 HPDE's per year) and the rest on street. No negative camber atm.

I run stock alignment settings and I have about 2-3mm clearance to the strut with the NT05's with a 25p 18x10.I have also run a 275 on a 30p 18x 9.5 with a 10mm spacer in order to clear the brakes with no issues at the front.I found when running with a 18 x 9.5 at 25p on the rear that an 18mm spacer helped a lot in balancing the car when running with the wider track in front.

[1MORELAP]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Sure do.18x10 25P 275/35 18's.A 285 on the rear would probally be ideal as it does have a little bit of oversteer in 2nd gear corners but is very neutral in 3rd and 4th gear corners.The main reason that I run square is that I can rotate the tires which reduces my running costs quite a bit.

Thanks, but how does this reduce running costs? Does the front wear much differently than the rear? I swap side to side, but what is the benefit of swapping front to rear? Unless you really, really want to replace 4 tires at a time?

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by 1MORELAP

Thanks, but how does this reduce running costs? Does the front wear much differently than the rear? I swap side to side, but what is the benefit of swapping front to rear? Unless you really, really want to replace 4 tires at a time?

You maximize the life out the tires by rotating.My rears wear the inside more at the fronts wear the outside more and by flipping them on the rim about half way through their life when they are worn out very even,not corded on the edge.I normally get about 10 hours out of an r compound tire by doing this which is about 4 track days.If the car was a dedicated track car with qa proper alignment it would probally not be an issue.My rears wear about twice as much as the fronts.

[Gearhead999s]

Here is a picture of my setup with the NT05's on it.

[Bubbles]

275/35/18s NT-01s on 10 inch rims all-around.

-1.9/-1.8 negative camber upfront on stock ZCP suspension. No spacers and no rubbing.


Fronts tire get beat up on the outside, a quick flip to the rear evens out the inside

A flip with the NT-O1s gave me three more track days otherwise the tires would have corded.

[008]

What wheels are you running Bubbles?

[1MORELAP]

Originally Posted by Bubbles

275/35/18s NT-01s on 10 inch rims all-around.

-1.9/-1.8 negative camber upfront on stock ZCP suspension. No spacers and no rubbing.


Fronts tire get beat up on the outside, a quick flip to the rear evens out the inside

A flip with the NT-O1s gave me three more track days otherwise the tires would have corded.

That is the type of feedback I need. So the stock allowed camber for front is just not enough while it works on the rear? Good to know. What offset are the wheels? ET27? I am looking at 18x10 ET25 wheels.

Also, have you seen my post on issues with stability control and square setup? Do you ever run stability on? Any issues with that? On my Porsche the tire size change as big as this one would freak out ESP, and I would have to completely turn it off.

I got ZCP, and it comes with an a "track/aggressive" setting that I would try using especially at first. Have you found it to get confused with the square setup. The front to rear rotation speed differential is now significantly different from stock...

[Bubbles]

Originally Posted by 008

What wheels are you running Bubbles?

Running the ARC-8 Satin Black ET25 from Paintpro. See thread http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=401416

Originally Posted by 1MORELAP

That is the type of feedback I need. So the stock allowed camber for front is just not enough while it works on the rear? Good to know. What offset are the wheels? ET27? I am looking at 18x10 ET25 wheels.

Also, have you seen my post on issues with stability control and square setup? Do you ever run stability on? Any issues with that? On my Porsche the tire size change as big as this one would freak out ESP, and I would have to completely turn it off.

I got ZCP, and it comes with an a "track/aggressive" setting that I would try using especially at first. Have you found it to get confused with the square setup. The front to rear rotation speed differential is now significantly different from stock...

ET25 offset, the car could use a bit more camber up front, but not worth it to install camber plates, I just chalk my tires to make sure the pressures stay around 38psi hot.

No issues with handling, the car is easy to rotate in MDM mode and even easier with traction control off. The car was very neutral and predictable.

Most BMWs require a lot negative camber upfront, but if you are just doing track days for fun, you shouldn't need more than the max setting you can achieve with the stock ZCP suspension. I run very close to a few of my buddies in their GT3s, maybe a second slower.

[1MORELAP]

OK, pretty much sold on the square setup.