Can anyone identify what leather this is?

[Dav3]

As per VIN the car is listed with LSA8 Leder Walknappa Sepang Bronze Hell as interior leather

I checked Z4 M leather option codes but couldn't find any matching color

Are these re-upholstered seats with non OEM leather?

Seller is saying they are the original seats as listed on VIN but picture distorted colors. Surely white doesn't turn into brown. What am I missing?

[The HACK]

You sure it’s LSA6, not LSD6?

http://www.bmwz4roadster.net/bmw_z4_interior_M.htm

Dark Sepang Bronze interior (Napa leather). The picture looks nothing like the real thing, by the way.

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by The HACK

You sure it’s LSA6, not LSD6?

http://www.bmwz4roadster.net/bmw_z4_interior_M.htm

Dark Sepang Bronze interior (Napa leather). The picture looks nothing like the real thing, by the way.

That's what I originally thought too but on car papers and on VIN backtrack, it's listed as LSA8, which essentially is white.

Towards the end of the ad, although pixelated, you'll see the LSA6 option on top

The car has had 3 owners, very low mileage, AC Schnitzer Pedal Set and non-identifiable seat leather. CarFax and Vin lookup checks out although it yielded limited information. It looks legit but something feels off..

[The HACK]

The "Leder Walknappa Sepang Bronze Hell" references the Dark Sepang Bronze interior color though, which the other pictures seems to indicate.

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by The HACK

The "Leder Walknappa Sepang Bronze Hell" references the Dark Sepang Bronze interior color though, which the other pictures seems to indicate.

Leder Walknappa Sepang Bronze Hell is this

Nothing like the other pictures look like...

[The HACK]

Originally Posted by Dav3

Leder Walknappa Sepang Bronze Hell is this

Nothing like the other pictures look like...

Walk away. Don't buy it.

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by The HACK

Walk away. Don't buy it.

Thing is, everything else checks out.

Ran the VIN through a handful of websites including paid reports and through official BMW channels (odometer readings + work done)

It's just these seats and that pedal set that don't add up.

Who knows

[The HACK]

It's a 10+ year old car. Look at the picture I posted. That's a 13 year old car with 50,000 miles of wear. Even I cringe sometimes and thought about hiring an upholsterer to re-do my Dark Sepang leather seats.

If you're convinced that the seats are LIGHT Sepang leather from the factory, the pictures in the for-sale post clearly shows it's NOT Light Sepang. Hell, I'd question if it's Dark Sepang from the pictures you posted. And if the seller insist that it IS original leather...Well, if you think they're lying about it, there's only one option.

Walk away.

Seriously, IF I were to have re-upholstered my Dark Sepang interior and were, god forbid, ever consider selling my car, I'd be honest about it and mention that it's been resurfaced. My used car buying process? If they're willing to lie about a re-upholstered interior, what else are they not telling you?

Anything that doesn't check out on a used car ad, walk away. About 5 or 6 years ago, I came across an ultra rare, E46 325iT with manual transmission for sale, less than 50,000 miles on it. I thought about pulling the trigger because it was priced just right, and the seller was the second owner. I inquired into the various CarFax and AutoCheck services, and no red-flags. The owner had all service records too, which was great, until I rummaged through the records and found a recent service, at 48,xxx miles, that the head gasket was replaced along with the water pump. I knew what it was, so I asked the owner what that service was about, and he said the head gasket was replaced for a small leak.

I walked away, despite it being the unicorn of all unicorns. The head gasket being replaced at the same time as the water pump means the pump seized, the engine overheated. It's as simple as that. Had they been honest with me and said the head gasket was replaced at the same time the water pump blew? No big deal. BMW plastic water pumps from the M52/54 era tend to grenade around 60-80K miles. Not uncommon, and absolutely not uncommon to replace the head gasket IF the mechanic suspect a possible warped head due to overheating.

But if they're not going to be forthright with me, there's no point looking further IMO. No matter how good of a deal it was, and believe you me, that 325iT with a manual would have been a fantastic buy (again, unicorn of all unicorns) even with a possible overheated block and warped head...since I can probably just swap in a used M54 3.0 or 2.5 AND still be under $12K at the time.

In my personal experience (and opinion), it is always better to walk away from a used car purchase than find ways to justify it. No matter how rare or how good the deal may seem.

[rockstar93]

That VIN decoder sheet also says Carbon Leather trim, but it looks like Piano Black to me.

Is it possible this is an individual car? From the pictures it honestly looks more like Cinnamon or Saddle Brown. Personally I love the colour lol, but it's true it's concerning if the owner doesn't know their own car or is trying to hide something.

Also wouldn't put much thought into the pedals - mine has these same pedals and they do (in my opinion) look and feel much better than the stock rubber ones and it isn't a difficult change to make.

[Dav3]

The HACK

Car was originally sold in Japan. Wouldn't be surprised if the local guys there at the dealership got the translation wrong or it was some database error.

I'll definitely rummage through the maintenance records like you have done for your 325iT. At its selling price you really can't screw up the research.

Speaking of research. I feel sorry for the poor suckers that won't do any of it and end up buying any of the 3/4 Z4M's that fell under my radar. Apparently salvage title Z4M's quickly get imported into Eastern Europe, repaired and put back into circulation. Only 1/3 sellers mentioned a crash and 0/3 mentioned the salvage title.

This said, seller sounds like a serious and respectable individual. Might just give him the benefit of the doubt until I check the car properly.


rockstar93

Very good calls. Didn't even notice the interior trim. I'm actually 80% sure the leather is cinnamon now that I looked at it on the e46 m3.

Maybe maybe, Japan had different configuration specs that weren't even setup in the BMW configuration database because of low production of the car and availability only there?

[The HACK]

If it was originally sold in Japan it would be RIGHT HAND DRIVE.

[Westersund]

Looks like "Cinnamon" aka "Zimt" leather to me.

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by The HACK

If it was originally sold in Japan it would be RIGHT HAND DRIVE.

Ordered in Japan with EU/US spec

It has a bit of a 'wtf' history as it technically was driven on three continents (US while testing)

Westersund

If it's OEM, it's definitely cinnamon from the e46. There's nothing else that looks remotely similar.

The real question is how a Z4M ended up with it

[Westersund]

Individual? Or taken from another car with individual.

[Jsinghzzzz]

Could have been professionally dyed as well?

[KevinC]

I don't know what color that is, but it looks fantastic. I wouldn't walk away! Also trim definitely not carbon leather, it's either piano black or.. ? Leather is definitely not dark sepang, it's a much deeper brown than that.

Biggest problem I see? Navigation. But that's my bugaboo, lots of people like having it.

[Dav3]

Westersund What other car in the bangle generation had those seats though? I found someone in Germany with these that look similair

Jsinghzzzz Someone dyed theirs here. Is it a common practice?

KevinC It's a nice color but I'm leaning towards carbon bits on the exterior and I'm not sure it will look strange/out of place.

Navigation is a non-issue. At least you can hide the panel unlike modern BMW's. iDrive system is probably prehistoric anyways so not really a selling point or a deal breaker

[Jsinghzzzz]

Originally Posted by Dav3

Westersund What other car in the bangle generation had those seats though? I found someone in Germany with these that look similair

Jsinghzzzz Someone dyed theirs here. Is it a common practice?

KevinC It's a nice color but I'm leaning towards carbon bits on the exterior and I'm not sure it will look strange/out of place.

Navigation is a non-issue. At least you can hide the panel unlike modern BMW's. iDrive system is probably prehistoric anyways so not really a selling point or a deal breaker

Wouldn't say it's common, but not out of the question either. Could be the previous owner didn't like the old color of the seats and wanted something his/her taste.

[Westersund]

Originally Posted by Dav3

Westersund What other car in the bangle generation had those seats though? I found someone in Germany with these that look similair

The seats are unique to the Z4 of the E85/86 generation.

The interior could be caramel but the picture is edited with more contrast and vibrance thus making it look like cinnamon.

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by Westersund

The seats are unique to the Z4 of the E85/86 generation.

The interior could be caramel but the picture is edited with more contrast and vibrance thus making it look like cinnamon.

These on a Z4 3.0i are tagged as caramel

Rest of dash is color matched too though

What are the odds the guys at the BMW dealership did a sneaky and exchanged seats and trim between cars? Maybe some personal favour to another client that wanted the white seats and the carbon interior?

I mean, either that or the seller is lying. But why would he?

[KevinC]

My theory is that the interior is all original, and that the VIN record of what it's supposed to have is wrong, for whatever reason. Looks too factory to me. I wouldn't shy away from that thing at all, at least not because of the interior color mystery.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by The HACK

It's a 10+ year old car. Look at the picture I posted. That's a 13 year old car with 50,000 miles of wear. Even I cringe sometimes and thought about hiring an upholsterer to re-do my Dark Sepang leather seats.

If you're convinced that the seats are LIGHT Sepang leather from the factory, the pictures in the for-sale post clearly shows it's NOT Light Sepang. Hell, I'd question if it's Dark Sepang from the pictures you posted. And if the seller insist that it IS original leather...Well, if you think they're lying about it, there's only one option.

Walk away.

Seriously, IF I were to have re-upholstered my Dark Sepang interior and were, god forbid, ever consider selling my car, I'd be honest about it and mention that it's been resurfaced. My used car buying process? If they're willing to lie about a re-upholstered interior, what else are they not telling you?

Anything that doesn't check out on a used car ad, walk away. About 5 or 6 years ago, I came across an ultra rare, E46 325iT with manual transmission for sale, less than 50,000 miles on it. I thought about pulling the trigger because it was priced just right, and the seller was the second owner. I inquired into the various CarFax and AutoCheck services, and no red-flags. The owner had all service records too, which was great, until I rummaged through the records and found a recent service, at 48,xxx miles, that the head gasket was replaced along with the water pump. I knew what it was, so I asked the owner what that service was about, and he said the head gasket was replaced for a small leak.

I walked away, despite it being the unicorn of all unicorns. The head gasket being replaced at the same time as the water pump means the pump seized, the engine overheated. It's as simple as that. Had they been honest with me and said the head gasket was replaced at the same time the water pump blew? No big deal. BMW plastic water pumps from the M52/54 era tend to grenade around 60-80K miles. Not uncommon, and absolutely not uncommon to replace the head gasket IF the mechanic suspect a possible warped head due to overheating.

But if they're not going to be forthright with me, there's no point looking further IMO. No matter how good of a deal it was, and believe you me, that 325iT with a manual would have been a fantastic buy (again, unicorn of all unicorns) even with a possible overheated block and warped head...since I can probably just swap in a used M54 3.0 or 2.5 AND still be under $12K at the time.

In my personal experience (and opinion), it is always better to walk away from a used car purchase than find ways to justify it. No matter how rare or how good the deal may seem.

Hardly anyone selling a used car is honest; the world just doesn't work that way. Not even CarMax is honest But with the head case you speak about, my thought is the owner was so clueless that he let the car overheat once the pump let go, so his description of why the head gasket was replaced is probably accurate as he understood it. If the head gasket was correctly repaired, why would it matter?