Wheel spacers double insurance premium?

[CrossyN]

So my F83 is currently insured as stock, as it is stock, but I've bought some spacers and just declaring the spacers alone on insurance takes the premiums from ~£650-750 to this:



What the...?! I'm 37, no points, no claims on record, 6 years NCB, nobody is paying this for insurance. So what are you guys doing? Just not declaring them?

I've deduced that anything which replaces OEM parts does the exact same thing i.e. declaring new springs. But a ECU chip barely affects the premium.

[Paul SR]

Not sure I would bother declaring spacers? I put some OEM carbon pieces on and existing insurer didn’t want to know so had to go with another insurer. I find it strange that they will cover if on the car at time of purchase with no increase in premium but the same pieces added afterwards increase the cost??

I gave up when trying to explain to the dunderhead at the insurance company what a carbon diffuser was....

[CrossyN]

I've never been sure what the implications are of not declaring a mod. I've always assumed that the reason they ask is so that they have something to void your claim over, if you don't tell them god forbid it you've flipping added a new air freshner or whatever insignificant addition you make to your own car... then they'll void your claim on that basis. But that could be my own paranoia, I've never actually known for sure. But it doesn't seem unreasonable to assume they ask these ridiculous questions because it's yet another thing to catch you out on if you ever needed to use the thing you're legally forced to buy.

[SteveChester]

I saw this before on Facebook - shared by Wirral Police - is it actually true? How would the Police know what mods you have/haven't declared? Would they really take your car off you because you had fitted a spoiler or black grills etc?

[CrossyN]

If it's true then that confirms my fear... if you don't declare a mod, your insurer immediately uses that as a reason to snake out of honouring a claim, so you're effectively uninsured.

I have absolutely no idea how in 2018 you're able to be extorted in this way via a service which is legally required.

Most people would just say "well don't mod your car then" to which I'd say and how would you feel if you weren't able to modify your house as dictated by your home insurer.

I'm boring myself bringing it up as it's a thing everybody just accepts now and are exhausted of complaining about, but just how this is allowed I have no idea. Paying more for your insurance because you put a spoiler on the back, really??

[SteveChester]

I'm pretty certain there was a test case where it was argued the mod made no difference to the claim, I.e if you fitted black grills and then someone ran into the back of you and wrote your car off then the undeclared black grills aren't really contributing to the crash.

That police advert is strange though.

[CrossyN]

That would be common sense, although it would be most peoples luck that your car would get pinched, smashed up, and then found to have a carbon fibre wrapped gear knob which obviously made the car more pinch-able. Claim void!

[corbs09]

I have heard of modifications not being covered in the event of an accident, or in the event of a total loss not getting compensated for them... but this seems a little extreme.

The best recommendation anyone can give you is to read your policy documents, or talk to your agent and have them send you the specific verbiage related to the modification of a covered vehicle. You will most likely get a lot better answers than on here.

[YMBF801989]

Originally Posted by TFI

So my F83 is currently insured as stock, as it is stock, but I've bought some spacers and just declaring the spacers alone on insurance takes the premiums from ~£650-750 to this:



What the...?! I'm 37, no points, no claims on record, 6 years NCB, nobody is paying this for insurance. So what are you guys doing? Just not declaring them?

I've deduced that anything which replaces OEM parts does the exact same thing i.e. declaring new springs. But a ECU chip barely affects the premium.

Look at people like Sky Insurance, Chris Knott, Adrian Flux. They're modified car specialists, so should sort you out.

I was paying circa £800 on a fully modified BMW 1 Series with 3 points, 2 non fault accidents, like for like cover with agreed value. Cost me more to insure as a factory car using price comparison sites!

[G35POPPEDMYCHERRY]

are you guys 4 real. Obvs my mods wont be covered, but are you insinuating that if I mod my car now all insurance claims can be voided

[Teeone]

I do not tell insurance about any mods and would not do so other than high cost items such as hre or bbs forged wheels.

[CrossyN]

Perhaps car insurance regs are different in the states, but in the UK yes this is for real. We have to declare any mods to the car, and not doing so could result in them using it as an excuse to not pay out.
The insurers don't ask about mods so that you're insured to replace them, they ask because (in their eyes) it increases the risk of an accident... especially with ECU tuning and alterations to the mechanics of the car.
Again, no idea what it's like in the states, but here they even go as far as charging you more for insurance if you park on the street instead of in a garage, if you have kids or not, hell even your job title can add 10-20% onto a premium if statistically software engineers have been in more accidents than nurses.

It's getting to the point where they'll be asking you your johnson size because apparently tiny pecker people drive faster to compensate... it's moronic.

[Poiseuille]

Originally Posted by SteveChester

I saw this before on Facebook - shared by Wirral Police - is it actually true? How would the Police know what mods you have/haven't declared? Would they really take your car off you because you had fitted a spoiler or black grills etc?

After reading this thread I may have to suspend complaining about insurance in the US. This post especially, but all the others as well seem really harsh. In this country, the worst that can happen is the insurance company won't reimburse you for the mods you've done. Several years ago I had a Z3 with enough Dinan mods to get a badge. 87 y/o woman in a Hyundai stuffed me up the back, totaled the car. Insurance company reimbursed me zero for the mods. Old fart in the Hyundai was uninsured.

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Poiseuille

After reading this thread I may have to suspend complaining about insurance in the US. This post especially, but all the others as well seem really harsh. In this country, the worst that can happen is the insurance company won't reimburse you for the mods you've done. Several years ago I had a Z3 with enough Dinan mods to get a badge. 87 y/o woman in a Hyundai stuffed me up the back, totaled the car. Insurance company reimbursed me zero for the mods. Old fart in the Hyundai was uninsured.

Which is fair and generally the outcome in the UK in my experience, the trouble starts when it's a serious accident and someone gets hurt or worse, then the police and lawyers get involved and everyone starts looking for a route out of their liability.

[YMBF801989]

Originally Posted by G35POPPEDMYCHERRY

are you guys 4 real. Obvs my mods wont be covered, but are you insinuating that if I mod my car now all insurance claims can be voided

Yes, in the UK, if you don't declare your mods, you are technically driving an uninsured car. Have an accident and you could not get paid out by the insurers.

[Paul SR]

Also if you don’t declare your mods and get stopped by the police e.g. speeding (or worse) then they can contact your insurer and find out whether you have declared your mods e.g lowered suspension, aggressive exhaust- if not then the insurer will void straight away and you get done for driving without insurance. This can include spoilers for example. Perhaps a little more difficult if OEM standard parts

[CrossyN]

It's such an annoyingly ambiguous area. The obvious solution is to declare aka ask permission from your insurer to modify your own property, to which they can double or treble the premium at their discretion.

If it really is all about safety concerns, why don't any insurers - not a single one of them, ask if the mods have been fitted by approved specialist centres or even dealership trained staff? If it was all about safety concerns, there'd be some differentiation with regards to whether it's a DIY job or fitted by a professional.

[Paul SR]

Originally Posted by TFI

It's such an annoyingly ambiguous area. The obvious solution is to declare aka ask permission from your insurer to modify your own property, to which they can double or treble the premium at their discretion.

If it really is all about safety concerns, why don't any insurers - not a single one of them, ask if the mods have been fitted by approved specialist centres or even dealership trained staff? If it was all about safety concerns, there'd be some differentiation with regards to whether it's a DIY job or fitted by a professional.

Agreed. Certainly an area that could be improved as well as industry standard ‘rating’ that would apply to various mods. A rear spoiler is not going to add 30 BHP.....well ok, mine does

[PJ69]

If you enter the mods in a comparison site, even once, the insurance companies now know you've modded your car.

Happened to me earlier this year. When I phoned up to challenge the renewal quote (which for the first time in history was actually lower than any new quote I could get) they asked me 4 times to confirm the car wasn't modded when I said "no it's standard!".

I had to tell them I'd looked up modded quotes because I wanted to see the effect on prices if I did decide to tune it later.

To be safe I'd phone Adrian Flux and deal with someone who goes out to the wider insurance market. A lot of underwriters know that people who spend money on their sports cars tend to look after them, especially something with a £60k plus price tag. After all, it's not a 1.2l Corsa with NOS and some 500psi turbo upgrade done by some apprentice mechanic on a driveway over the weekend is it?

[YMBF801989]

Originally Posted by PJ69

If you enter the mods in a comparison site, even once, the insurance companies now know you've modded your car.

Happened to me earlier this year. When I phoned up to challenge the renewal quote (which for the first time in history was actually lower than any new quote I could get) they asked me 4 times to confirm the car wasn't modded when I said "no it's standard!".

I had to tell them I'd looked up modded quotes because I wanted to see the effect on prices if I did decide to tune it later.

To be safe I'd phone Adrian Flux and deal with someone who goes out to the wider insurance market. A lot of underwriters know that people who spend money on their sports cars tend to look after them, especially something with a £60k plus price tag. After all, it's not a 1.2l Corsa with NOS and some 500psi turbo upgrade done by some apprentice mechanic on a driveway over the weekend is it?

Avoid Adrian Flux. They are expensive. Chris Knott, Sky Insurance are who I'd be contacting. They wanted 4x more money to insure my STANDARD M3 compared to Churchill. When I asked why is it so expensive, they couldn't give me an answer so I left them.

On my fully modified 1 Series, they were both the cheapest with all mods declared, like for like and agreed value.

[officedog]

I am literally just in the process of fitting some new spacers and the MP HAS kit, with a view of also fitting the M Performance Exhaust.

Quote from my current insurer (lv.com) to add these onto the my policy for the rest if the term was £20, so I estimate a full year cost of £40.

No-brainer to add at that cost really.