F80 Wheel Hop 1st and 2nd gear (6MT)

[F30MSport]

Hello and Happy New Year!

Granted it's only 44F here in NJ but in the higher RPM range in 1st and 2nd (6MT) gear when I loose traction (DSC off, MDM off) the rear wheels stutter and hop which is driving me nuts. When it occurs I'll come off the gas pedal but it's extremely frustrating.

I've only seen one other thread about this and some mentioned spacers helped (not sure why spacers would help), but are other F80/82 owners experiencing this? Even 2nd gear pulls, I'll spin the tires after 5k RPM, the car in general breaks the tires loose easily but the wheel hop is bad.

I know IRS (Independent Rear Suspension ) are prone to this stuff; it reminds me of the 99 SVT cobra's in which I helped a buddy swap it for a straight rear. Didn't expect this on a '16 M3

Anyone else ? Trans choice shouldn't matter butu any thoughts/solutions? Lowering tire pressure? Spacers? Ditch the Continentals that it came with?

[gvan1998]

I'm experiencing wheel hop as well on my DCT and I only have 300 miles on my car.

[Warranty P]

No wheel hop here. Looks like user error.

[F30MSport]

Originally Posted by Warranty P

No wheel hop here. Looks like user error.

Seriously man c'mon this isn't "user error" but a one user amongst others looking for some solutions

[F30MSport]

Originally Posted by gvan1998

I'm experiencing wheel hop as well on my DCT and I only have 300 miles on my car.

Under the same conditions as I described in the original post?

[nonagon]

I'm not sure if switching to a firmer setting solves the issue but this has only happened to me in the suspension's comfort mode...

[F30MSport]

Originally Posted by nonagon

I'm not sure if switching to a firmer setting solves the issue but this has only happened to me in the suspension's comfort mode...

I've got passive suspension; not sure if not having adaptive M may contribute

[gvan1998]

Originally Posted by F30MSport

Under the same conditions as I described in the original post?

Yup under same condition. It was about 43 degrees here, I wonder how much did the summer tires contribute to the wheel hop since it was cold. I hope I didn't break anything since I'm still in the break in phase with 300 miles.

[F30MSport]

Originally Posted by gvan1998

Yup under same condition. It was about 43 degrees here, I wonder how much did the summer tires contribute to the wheel hop since it was cold. I hope I didn't break anything since I'm still in the break in phase with 300 miles.

Doubt anything broke but have to be careful; obviously it puts stress on the rear end.

[Salespunk]

Wheel hop is harmonic vibration. Nothing that can really be done about it since GM patented asymmetrical links to each wheel as a way to stop it on their V Series cars. I have it in my car too in some situations. It will tear apart the rear end of your car if you don't get out of the gas when it starts.

[Doctor///M]

Cold tires? Cold pavement? Your ability to get traction is completely dependent on the conditions in which you are driving relative to your throttle modulation (and steering input for performance driving). With any RWD car as capable as your M4, expect better results in warmer weather.

[Brasko]

Originally Posted by F30MSport

Hello and Happy New Year!

Granted it's only 44F here in NJ but in the higher RPM range in 1st and 2nd (6MT) gear when I loose traction (DSC off, MDM off) the rear wheels stutter and hop which is driving me nuts. When it occurs I'll come off the gas pedal but it's extremely frustrating.

I've only seen one other thread about this and some mentioned spacers helped (not sure why spacers would help), but are other F80/82 owners experiencing this? Even 2nd gear pulls, I'll spin the tires after 5k RPM, the car in general breaks the tires loose easily but the wheel hop is bad.

I know IRS (Independent Rear Suspension ) are prone to this stuff; it reminds me of the 99 SVT cobra's in which I helped a buddy swap it for a straight rear. Didn't expect this on a '16 M3

Anyone else ? Trans choice shouldn't matter butu any thoughts/solutions? Lowering tire pressure? Spacers? Ditch the Continentals that it came with?

I totally get what you are talking about. Having owned a Supercharged Steed with Cobra IRS, I think your reference is spot on. I was thinking of swapping to a set of the Dinan Rear Suspension Links to combat this. It's cold here in Oregon and a lot of ice on the roads so I might wait till summer to install them.

[DrtyJrze]

Originally Posted by F30MSport

Seriously man c'mon this isn't "user error" but a one user amongst others looking for some solutions

It's user error. You can't mash on the gas with cold summer tires on cold roads.

Try again in the spring, just make sure to keep the TC on. Otherwise the user error you'll experience could be much worse than wheel hop...

[Tuner1]

Originally Posted by F30MSport

Granted it's only 44F here in NJ but in the higher RPM range in 1st and 2nd (6MT) gear when I loose traction (DSC off, MDM off) the rear wheels stutter and hop which is driving me nuts. When it occurs I'll come off the gas pedal but it's extremely frustrating.

Front engine, RWD and stiff springs/dampers = not uncommon to get wheel hop (aka axle tramp) at lower speeds on low-grip surfaces. This problem isn't exclusive to the F8X chassis - my E90 M3 did it a lot with the stock suspension and KW V3s. My Supra BPU+ MKIV did it too but that was 15 years ago

[Falafel Combo]

Happens to me all the time. I just assumed it was because of the stiff bolted rear end. But again, I really have no clue.

[Jeffe]

Has happened to me before as well as on a couple other cars I've owned. Never had a problem with the rear end from it. It's all dependent on the setting of where you're driving. If it's 95 degrees out with a set of warm tires, obviously it doesn't happen much. But that's now always the case for us guys in the northeast. I really don't think it's that big of a deal.

[shortseller]

Originally Posted by Jeffe

Has happened to me before as well as on a couple other cars I've owned. Never had a problem with the rear end from it. It's all dependent on the setting of where you're driving. If it's 95 degrees out with a set of warm tires, obviously it doesn't happen much. But that's now always the case for us guys in the northeast. I really don't think it's that big of a deal.

Agreed.

[Vectors2final]

No wheel hop here... even on R Comp tires below their operating temp.

[F83]

I've experienced it with DSC on but never with the nannies off. I've always assumed that was the byproduct of the traction control system trying to get things under control.

[teefive]

Definition according to GM's patent:

Problematically, axle shafts frequently exhibit “powerhop” when a large amount of torque is applied thereto. Powerhop typically occurs when tire friction with respect to a road surface is periodically exceeded by low frequency (i.e., below about 20 Hz) oscillations in torsional windup of the axle shafts. Powerhop produces oscillatory feedback to suspension and driveline components and can be felt by the vehicle occupants, who may describe the sensation as “bucking,” “banging,” “kicking” or “hopping.”

[Ian1973]

It's user error. Sometimes it happens to me and others it doesn't.

If I got out of it and stopped the hop and then back in it, it's fine. If it doesn't happen every time or can be corrected instantly, then it's user error in my opinion.

[Brasko]

Originally Posted by teefive

Definition according to GM's patent:

Problematically, axle shafts frequently exhibit “powerhop” when a large amount of torque is applied thereto. Powerhop typically occurs when tire friction with respect to a road surface is periodically exceeded by low frequency (i.e., below about 20 Hz) oscillations in torsional windup of the axle shafts. Powerhop produces oscillatory feedback to suspension and driveline components and can be felt by the vehicle occupants, who may describe the sensation as “bucking,” “banging,” “kicking” or “hopping.”

Thanks for sharing. This is a very interesting find. Did you find this through a USPTO search? It's obviously well worded and structured in a sense to take ownership. Just find it hard to imagine someone wanting to patent that problem.