[Rant/]Bodyshop nightmare

[Powaup]

Alright I've been wanting to do this for a while now but was hoping the whole situation to be over with before I begin ranting but it's gone so far that I can't take it anymore. Panel Craft had my M4 for a total of 54 days and my car has been sitting idle at BMW of Weatherford for 20 days (as of 07.13.15)



On April 5th 2015, I got into my first accident ever, my car was hit by a wild turkey causing damage to the side view mirror, driver door, windows and interior.

A couple days later I met with a Geico inspector and after he suggested I take my car to a Body Shop specialized in high end cars I ended up dropping it off to a body shop called Panel Craft in Berkeley, CA and that was the beginning of a shit show I'm still not out of...

Cliffnotes:
-Panel Craft made more damage to the car than what was done by the turkey and they could not paint my door properly
-They Painted my car door 5x and after the 5th time the owner told me he was going to order some "illegal"(his words) paint from Nevada, I told him no, instead lets outsource all remaining work to the local BMW collision center, and he agrees
-I take the car to the BMW collision center with a door with unfinished paint and they determine that Panel Craft has painted the door so many times that it has to be replaced
-Panel craft tries to get Geico to pitch in on repairs but Geico has already paid them so they decline
- Panel Craft then agrees to pay for the door replacement but not for some of the required materials; adhesive tape/ clamps... totaling $190+TAX

Full notes of Situation:

Panel craft history: April 5th: accident

April 8th: meet with inspector at Geico repair center, he recommends I go to a higher end shop and gives me repair estimate report. I search yelp and contact bay bridge bimmers and mini and they recommend me to panel craft. I drive to panel craft, show them the claim estimate and tell Andrew and his father(Owner) the thermostat screen was damaged but not included in the Geico estimate. Drop car off at panel craft, they estimate it will take a week to 10 days to fix my car

April 17th: I call Andrew and he tells me they had to ship in parts from Germany that will take 7-10 days to arrive

April 24th: Andrew tells me parts have arrived from Germany

April 29th: Andrew tells me he had to repaint the car because he did not like the first job

April 30: Andrew tells me car is ready, I drive from Novato to Oakland but get call from Andrew saying that the window won't roll up when the door is closed, asks if I want to pick it up now or have them fix it the next day. I decide to leave it

Friday May 1st: I pick the car up but notice the paint does not match. And the driver side window and dashboard glass looks dirty. I also notice that the thermostat screen was not replaced. Drive home. Try to clean window streaks and dashboard glass using RainX but without success. At this point I figure it must be glue or some other substance hard to remove. I also notice comfort access is not working on the driver side door.

May 13th: Drop the car off to fix as much as possible before bimmerfest

May 19th: Pick up the M4 drop off 528i. Window and comfort access are fixed but that's it, thermostat is still the same, car was not painted, tachometer glass is still dirty

June 1st: I call to ask if I can drop the car off. They say that next Monday will be better and that they might have to make an appointment with Weatherford BMW to install the scratched LED thermostat screen

June 8th. Drop m4 off, pick up 5 series headlights are clear but car was not detailed as Andrew said he would. Andrew rights down things that will be fixed on M4: interior temp screen, tachometer and door will be repainted. "We will try to get the car back to you by the end of the week"

June 12th. 945am: I call and Andrew tells me that they received the wrong interior console from Germany. Says they painted the door and that he will try to finish the rest of the car by end of the day so I can pick it up
4pm: I call and Andrew tells me that the car won't be ready today because he does not like the paint job that was done so he will repaint the car again on Monday and try to get the car back to me next Tuesday. I inquire about the center console and he tells me it will take 2 weeks for them to receive the new console

June 16 1045AM:
I call: I am told that the clear coat on my car had a defect and that they will have to re-install it. The interior console is in pieces and they will have to call a guy to put it back together before they get it back to me. Andrew is going to call BMW of Weatherford to get an ETA on the interior piece coming from Germany. Andrew never calls back to give me the ETA

061715 Says the car will be sand and buffed tomorrow. And will call me tomorrow at 11am for an update to let me know if the paint job was done properly.

061815 Noon: no missed calls
3.30pm: I call and Andrew tells me that they repainted the car every single day this week except for today. He also tells me that he ordered a special filter that will help them paint the door. Filter will arrive tomorrow and door will be painted tomorrow. He then tells me that they will fix the tachometer glass after painting the car. He also tells me that there is a possibility they will get me my car back tomorrow. Lastly Andrew tells me that according to BMW of Weatherford the interior console piece (to replace thermostat screen) will arrive early next week and that it will be a one day job to install it.

061915
Andrew tells me they painted the door and it looks good but they won't be able to give me the car today because it has to be sanded and buffed

062215
Dave calls me and tells me the paint job did not come out well. He thinks it has to do with the water based paint they're using. He now wants to order some illegal paint from Nevada because he says that it'll do a better job. Tells me that if this doesn't work he will outsource the job.

I call weatherford and concord collision center and they inform me that BMW uses only water based paint

I call Dave back and tell him BMW only uses water based paint and that I now want the job outsourced to BMW of weatherford collision center. He tells me he will put the car back together and that it will be ready in a day

Maurice at BMW of Weatherford tells me to bring the car in, I need to bring insurance estimate paper work and come in person

062315
945am. Andrew leaves a voice mail asking that I call back
10am. I call and Dave picks up. Dave asks if he can send just the door to weatherford because it will save him time and money. He saves he will pay for whatever I desire at this point. I tell him they need the whole car. He asks if he can just put the door together without the handles. I tell him no I need the car put completely back together. He then asks about the interior console piece (for scratched thermostat screen) I tell him that I want that installed at weatherford as well and he agrees. He says he's gonna put my car back together now and that he hopes to have it ready for me to pick up and drop off by the end of the day. Dave also says that he has not been able to get in touch with Geico to inform them about moving the car.

1015am
I call Dave porter, my geico claim inspector. Give him a recap on the situation and he tells me that geico does not necessarily need to be involved at this point since Panel Craft is paying for the repairs. Dave will send me an updated cost report within 1 hour/ 30 minutes once he is done with his current client

2pm.
I call and Andrew tells me that he's looking for their electrician in order to put my upper dash back together. He says he will call me back at 3 to let me know if car will be ready for me to pick up today

450pm
At Panel Craft. Andrew tells me that Weatherford will contact Panel craft. Anything the insurance OK'd that panel craft was unable to do Panel Craft will pay for it. If any extra work needs to be done weatherford will go through the insurance. A geico agent will be sent to them in order to update claim cost/estimate.

Andrew calls about interior piece. His contact is clocked out so he will call him back tomorrow to get an update on the interior piece. He will assure that they leave the piece at weatherford so that they can install it

062415
1120AM
Maurice calls: tells me the trim on the exterior of door is damaged and the whole door needs to be replaced. I tell him that panel craft will have to pay for it since it's something they messed up. Says he will keep inspecting the car and will update me on his findings this afternoon.

062515
250pm
Maurice tells me they're gonna need $5k to replace the door. Wants me to be driving force.

062615
Maurice tells me Geico and panel craft will be involved. Geico is sending a representative to go over BMW collisions center estimate.

[GONE ON VACATION FOR 10 days]

070915
I have a voicemail from Larry from geico, he says geico will not pay for anymore repairs since they paid panel craft already

071015
I call Maurice, he tells me that panel craft has not paid anything yet and that geico and panel craft are sending over a rep to go over my car today again.

Larry from geico: geico will not pay for anything else because they already paid for repairs at panel craft. Panel craft is trying to get out of replacing the quarter window and outside damage to black trim.

Andrew at panel craft: he is going to BMW collision center to drop off a check to initiate on the door of my car. They are not paying for outside minor trim damage

071315
Maurice calls and leaves a voicemail: panel craft is not willing to pay for all the repairs to the door

I call Maurice: panel craft isn't paying for adhesives and clamps require to replace door, which totals to $190+TAX.
---------------------------------
P.S: It's hard to see in pictures how bad the door was painted but my mom can tell the difference without her glasses on and so do the Panel Craft, Geico and BMW representatives.



previous thread from accident: http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1111745

[Naz24]

Good god. You really got the run around....


Get a lawyer

[Captain Titanium]

So did you take the car to Geico's shop merely because they recommended it; or does your policy with Geico and/or Geico's practice "guarantee" the repairs if you agree to go to one of their recommended shops? If the latter, then you can hold Geico's feet to the fire to make this right at their expense. Bottom line, it is usually the owner's sole responsibility to select the repair shop and thereby suffer the consequences of the quality of the repair work. However, many auto insurers hjave negotiated contracts with various repair shops and as a result they are willing to guarantee the work. Find out what you have any see if you have any relief there.

By the way, is Geico charging you a collision or comprehensive deductible? Usually, collisions with animals (such as a deer) are classified under comprehensive. Not only is the deductible usually lower, but in most states comp losses are not chargeable against your premium.

Really sorry for your troubles. I've had body shop nightmare stories in the past and they suck, plain and simple. Good luck and I hope you get this resolved favorably as soon as possible.

Mark

[F83]

Horrible horrible story. Waiting to see who is going to stand up here and do right by you. Agree with previous posters that a) if this is Geico's shop they have some accountability and b) you may need a lawyer before this is over. That's what they're for. Plus sometimes letting the various parties know that you're getting a lawyer changed their attitude.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by F83

Horrible horrible story. Waiting to see who is going to stand up here and do right by you. Agree with previous posters that a) if this is Geico's shop they have some accountability and b) you may need a lawyer before this is over. That's what they're for. Plus sometimes letting the various parties know that you're getting a lawyer changed their attitude.

I am pretty sure that last sentence is a threat hence illegal.

[X2Board]

That's a load of bull from Geico, if you use the shop they recommended and the work was sub-par, then they are on the hook to fix it, and it's up to them to get their money back from the shop. I never used their recommended shop when I needed body work, because I didn't trust any shop that was in the business of saving the insurance company money.

[X2Board]

Originally Posted by ASAP

I am pretty sure that last sentence is a threat hence illegal.

How is that a threat?

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by X2Board

How is that a threat?

My understanding is that you can't go around and blackmail with a lawsuit... you simply do it without saying... saying you are getting lawyers is implying that.

[RocketBoots]

What a nightmare!!

I saw you post a while back where you said you wished you had your car; I thought for a sec it might be related to the turkey, but then figured there's no way this repair could take months.

I don't understand how Alpine White is "hard" to match, for a "high-end" body shop. So bad you Mom can see without her glasses?! WTF. And gunk on the dash screen, windshield, window is unacceptable. And ordering console trim parts from Germany... just get it from a dealer, or BMWPartsPros, or Tischer... really, WTF.

Honestly, I'm speechless. Best of luck getting all this resolved, quickly. I agree you may need to get a lawyer, and it's definitely the body shops fault.

Wow, that DAMN TURKEY!

[X2Board]

Originally Posted by ASAP

My understanding is that you can't go around and blackmail with a lawsuit... you simply do it without saying... saying you are getting lawyers is implying that.

No, that is not correct. The "threat" of a lawsuit, is not a threat in itself. A threat would be 'I'll burn your f-ing shop to the ground if you don't pay to get my car fixed right'.

[RocketBoots]

Originally Posted by X2Board

That's a load of bull from Geico, if you use the shop they recommended and the work was sub-par, then they are on the hook to fix it, and it's up to them to get their money back from the shop. I never used their recommended shop when I needed body work, because I didn't trust any shop that was in the business of saving the insurance company money.

I have heard, and this is completely unfounded, that 'recommended' body shops have agreements with insurance companies because they need the business. For whatever reason (shoddy work, low quality, bad location, bad luck, etc) they don't get enough business. But the insurance companies really exploit these body shops, and pay them very little. I don't know how much truth there is to these claims, or if it's even legal.

[Powaup]

Originally Posted by Captain Titanium

So did you take the car to Geico's shop merely because they recommended it; or does your policy with Geico and/or Geico's practice "guarantee" the repairs if you agree to go to one of their recommended shops? If the latter, then you can hold Geico's feet to the fire to make this right at their expense. Bottom line, it is usually the owner's sole responsibility to select the repair shop and thereby suffer the consequences of the quality of the repair work. However, many auto insurers hjave negotiated contracts with various repair shops and as a result they are willing to guarantee the work. Find out what you have any see if you have any relief there.

By the way, is Geico charging you a collision or comprehensive deductible? Usually, collisions with animals (such as a deer) are classified under comprehensive. Not only is the deductible usually lower, but in most states comp losses are not chargeable against your premium.

Really sorry for your troubles. I've had body shop nightmare stories in the past and they suck, plain and simple. Good luck and I hope you get this resolved favorably as soon as possible.

Mark

Originally Posted by F83

Horrible horrible story. Waiting to see who is going to stand up here and do right by you. Agree with previous posters that a) if this is Geico's shop they have some accountability and b) you may need a lawyer before this is over. That's what they're for. Plus sometimes letting the various parties know that you're getting a lawyer changed their attitude.

Originally Posted by X2Board

That's a load of bull from Geico, if you use the shop they recommended and the work was sub-par, then they are on the hook to fix it, and it's up to them to get their money back from the shop. I never used their recommended shop when I needed body work, because I didn't trust any shop that was in the business of saving the insurance company money.

I did not use the Geico recommended shop, I met with the inspector there but he recommended I find another body shop that is used to more higher end cars.
So I called bay Bridge bimmers and mini (where my friend got a work done on his car and had a positive experience) but they told me they did not have a painter at the moment so they recommended Panel Craft... let's just say I won't be using either shop ever going forward

[/// M sa]

Originally Posted by ASAP

My understanding is that you can't go around and blackmail with a lawsuit... you simply do it without saying... saying you are getting lawyers is implying that.

You offended me with that comment, I am getting a lawyer now come after me

[Drizz]

Wow. Sounds like bad luck all around and not the best folks working on the car. Sorry to hear about this. Good luck going forward.

[Powaup]

Originally Posted by Naz24

Good god. You really got the run around....


Get a lawyer

Originally Posted by RocketBoots

What a nightmare!!

I saw you post a while back where you said you wished you had your car; I thought for a sec it might be related to the turkey, but then figured there's no way this repair could take months.

I don't understand how Alpine White is "hard" to match, for a "high-end" body shop. So bad you Mom can see without her glasses?! WTF. And gunk on the dash screen, windshield, window is unacceptable. And ordering console trim parts from Germany... just get it from a dealer, or BMWPartsPros, or Tischer... really, WTF.

Honestly, I'm speechless. Best of luck getting all this resolved, quickly. I agree you may need to get a lawyer, and it's definitely the body shops fault.

Wow, that DAMN TURKEY!

I'm at the point where I'm so fed up and worn out of this whole situation that I'm gonna go ahead and pay the $190+Tax...
I just got back from vacation full of energy and after this morning I feel completely zapped. What really bugs me is that I'm also going to have to go to Panel Craft to pay them my $500 deductible (on top of the $190+ I'll be putting for repairs)

[OneRib]

Originally Posted by Powaup

I did not use the Geico recommended shop, I met with the inspector there but he recommended I find another body shop that is used to more higher end cars.
So I called bay Bridge bimmers and mini (where my friend got a work done on his car and had a positive experience) but they told me they did not have a painter at the moment so they recommended Panel Craft... let's just say I won't be using either shop ever going forward

That is the BS right there. They SHOULD have recommended another BMW dealer. I bet they didn't because they were afraid of looking bad or losing business. Very LAME.

[OneRib]

Originally Posted by Powaup

I'm at the point where I'm so fed up and worn out of this whole situation that I'm gonna go ahead and pay the $190+Tax...
I just got back from vacation full of energy and after this morning I feel completely zapped. What really bugs me is that I'm also going to have to go to Panel Craft to pay them my $500 deductible (on top of the $190+ I'll be putting for repairs)

Pay it in pennies.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by /// M sa

You offended me with that comment, I am getting a lawyer now come after me

Lol, welcome to modern America.

[wazzza]

One word: Lawyer.

[kdphan]

wow. just wow.

[Doctor///M]

dang, and for AW above all colors??? I'll be taking extra care since who knows if anyone can match AY. Good luck with getting it sorted out OP!

[myzmak]

Originally Posted by Powaup

Alright I've been wanting to do this for a while now but was hoping the whole situation to be over with before I begin ranting but it's gone so far that I can't take it anymore. Panel Craft had my M4 for a total of 54 days and my car has been sitting idle at BMW of Weatherford for 20 days (as of 07.13.15)

fucking turkeys.

Anyway Powaup:

(1) Man, that all sucks.

(2) it really sucks

(3) You have demonstrated great patience

(4) I hate insurance companies. Yours has not been brutal but, well, I just need to say that every now and again.

As for what to do, your last post is the most sensible:

Originally Posted by Powaup

I'm at the point where I'm so fed up and worn out of this whole situation that I'm gonna go ahead and pay the $190+Tax...
I just got back from vacation full of energy and after this morning I feel completely zapped. What really bugs me is that I'm also going to have to go to Panel Craft to pay them my $500 deductible (on top of the $190+ I'll be putting for repairs)

It is only $190 and some change. just pay it. be done with it. It will suck and you will badmouth these guys forever (and thus cost them a lot more than $190 over the course of time) but anything else just is not worth your time.

....now for the other advice...

Originally Posted by Naz24

Good god. You really got the run around....

Get a lawyer

No. Don't. OP is only out $190+ tax. Any lawyer you can hire for less than that is not worth even the tiny fee in question.

Originally Posted by F83

Horrible horrible story. Waiting to see who is going to stand up here and do right by you. Agree with previous posters that a) if this is Geico's shop they have some accountability and b) you may need a lawyer before this is over. That's what they're for. Plus sometimes letting the various parties know that you're getting a lawyer changed their attitude.

Lawyers should not be used on $200 disputes. It isn't what they are for.

....and the threat never works as well as people who don't use lawyers think it will. On a $200 dispute it is such an easy bluff to call it just wont work and will only stretch out this long story even longer.

Originally Posted by utsavized

One word: Lawyer.

Four more words: don't bother with one. See above for why.

-----

As for this debate, this is actually a matter of interest:

Originally Posted by ASAP

I am pretty sure that last sentence is a threat hence illegal.

Originally Posted by ASAP

My understanding is that you can't go around and blackmail with a lawsuit... you simply do it without saying... saying you are getting lawyers is implying that.

Originally Posted by X2Board

No, that is not correct. The "threat" of a lawsuit, is not a threat in itself. A threat would be 'I'll burn you f-ing shop to the ground if you don't pay to get my car fixed right'.

ASAP has the right instinct, but is not quite right.

So here is a 30 second primer:
- threatening someone in order to gain a commercial advantage can be extortion and, thus, a crime.

What counts as extortion? Physical violence, for sure. But (to the surprise of many) so does a lot of non-commercial pressure. For instance saying "I will report you to the police unless you do X" is probably also extortion (can't tell you the number of clients I've had who want to make this threat......all of whom are surprised when I say 'no, we can't'")

But threatening litigation doesn't count. Why not? 2 reasons:

(1) Ordinary commercial pressure is usually not extortive. "If you don't sell this to me for this price, I will go somewhere else" - it is a threat, but not improper. Litigation is (or should be) good faith pursuit of commercial rights, so it isn't illegitimate pressure.

(2) As a matter of policy, there is a current underlying a lot of jurisprudence that tries to push people to settle rather than litigate commercial disputes (I could go on about the issue of past consideration...but I wont). Generally, the law would prefer 2 parties resolve a dispute than sue and fight over it. Making it illegal to settle a dispute with a threat of litigation would make that very hard....so, even if the lawsuit is BS (and not really proper commercial pressure) the law says it is generally not extortion to threaten a lawsuit. In Canada, threatening a civil lawsuit is expressly excluded from extortion in our criminal statute.


....could there be exceptions to that where certain threats are extortive? Sure. possibly. I dunno, this is a post on a car forum not legal advice but....FWIW those are some general guiding concepts in this area.

(also: I should probably add that extortion is pretty codified (ie: written down) in a lot of jurisdictions so what constitutes the specific offence may vary depending on what jurisdiction is at issue)