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      04-16-2014, 08:18 AM   #1
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2011 X5M Tuned vs 2014 M5 CP

kind of off topic but i have an 2011 X5M with a velos tune and i swear it's faster than my 2014 m5 CP, i'm hoping that once i get the break in done on the m5 it'll pick up some speed, but my x5m just pulls sooo hard, the further i mash the accelerator the harder it pulls, i don't get that with the m5. i've read even after the break in service the car doesn't change much if any. i still like my M5 but the X5M just pulls sooo hard and that's without the M button, with the M button and trans sport mode it feels amazing! anyone else with any experience
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      04-16-2014, 08:23 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray101381 View Post
kind of off topic but i have an 2011 X5M with a velos tune and i swear it's faster than my 2014 m5 CP, i'm hoping that once i get the break in done on the m5 it'll pick up some speed, but my x5m just pulls sooo hard, the further i mash the accelerator the harder it pulls, i don't get that with the m5. i've read even after the break in service the car doesn't change much if any. i still like my M5 but the X5M just pulls sooo hard and that's without the M button, with the M button and trans sport mode it feels amazing! anyone else with any experience
Have you gone Full Throttle already with the M5 before Break-In?

Many say that there is no change in the M5's software or performance after Break-In and that only fluids are changed, but I'm not 100% convinced. How much horsepower is your X5M making with the tune? Are you mashing the X5M on the roll or from a standstill. From a roll the M5 with Sport+ everything, especially with the Comp Pack, will be faster than a tuned X5M. A Comp Pack M5 is making somewhere north of 600hp stock and weighs almost a 1,000lbs less than the X5M.
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      04-16-2014, 08:26 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by RPiM5 View Post
Have you gone Full Throttle already with the M5 before Break-In?

Many say that there is no change in the M5's software or performance after Break-In and that only fluids are changed, but I'm not 100% convinced. How much horsepower is your X5M making with the tune? Are you mashing the X5M on the roll or from a standstill. From a roll the M5 with Sport+ everything, especially with the Comp Pack, will be faster than a tuned X5M. A Comp Pack M5 is making somewhere north of 600hp stock and weighs almost a 1,000lbs less than the X5M.
no i have't floored the M5 yet, but when driving the X5M i don't floor that either, both scenarios are in highway passing situations from a roll. X5M is putting down to the wheels 546 ft/lbs at 2500 and 486whp at 6000, maybe it's the gobs of torque i'm feeling in the X5M that makes me feel like i'm being pushed back in the seat. i know in my m5 the torque vs whp numbers are flip flopped.
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      04-16-2014, 08:44 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray101381 View Post
no i have't floored the M5 yet, but when driving the X5M i don't floor that either, both scenarios are in highway passing situations from a roll. X5M is putting down to the wheels 546 ft/lbs at 2500 and 486whp at 6000, maybe it's the gobs of torque i'm feeling in the X5M that makes me feel like i'm being pushed back in the seat. i know in my m5 the torque vs whp numbers are flip flopped.
Yeah just wait until your done with break-in. You're viewpoint will change after you've done a 60-130 Full Throttle Pull on Sport+ everything in the F10. Before I did downpipes and when I only had exhaust I was making 529tq to the wheel in my F10.

Also sorry about last weekend. I wanted to finish up my video project on my M5. I going to be out of town this weekend. So maybe next week we can do a photoshoot.
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      04-16-2014, 08:46 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPiM5 View Post
Yeah just wait until your done with break-in. You're viewpoint will change after you've done a 60-130 Full Throttle Pull on Sport+ everything in the F10.

Also sorry about last weekend. I wanted to finish up my video project on my M5. I going to be out of town this weekend. So maybe next week we can do a photoshoot.
yeah no worries, clear bra is on and i got the spacers and LED interior done so just waiting to make an exhaust decision, i really hope someone cracks the DME i'd love to do downpipes and a tune!
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      04-16-2014, 09:34 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by ray101381 View Post
yeah no worries, clear bra is on and i got the spacers and LED interior done so just waiting to make an exhaust decision, i really hope someone cracks the DME i'd love to do downpipes and a tune!
Do Akrapovic for sure. My buddy did it on his M6 GC. Sounds very good. Only exhaust I have heard that didn't make it sound like just a loud turbo. Akra makes it sound like a performance car.
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      04-16-2014, 10:04 AM   #7
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It depends what you are looking for, you can have slightly louder car with mild performance gains, much louder car with mild performance gains, stupid sounding car with no performance gains. I won't name the names, but most of you know the brands associated with each option. At the end of the day, you should know that you are not buying an exhaust for performance reasons in the M5. BMW engineers did a very good job at maximizing the performance of the stock exhaust with enough airflow to eliminate any possible doubts about upgrading. I ran 11.3 with OEM exhaust and tires so hopefully that tells you something.
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      04-16-2014, 10:08 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greentrbo95gst View Post
It depends what you are looking for, you can have slightly louder car with mild performance gains, much louder car with mild performance gains, stupid sounding car with no performance gains. I won't name the names, but most of you know the brands associated with each option. At the end of the day, you should know that you are not buying an exhaust for performance reasons in the M5. BMW engineers did a very good job at maximizing the performance of the stock exhaust with enough airflow to eliminate any possible doubts about upgrading. I ran 11.3 with OEM exhaust and tires so hopefully that tells you something.
totally agree with you, not looking for performance gains as acatback really doesn't do anything. i like the way downpipes and akra together sound but without a tune i won't do DP's. the akra alone is too quiet in my opinion. i'm leaning toward the eisenmann race or sport with centerpipes if the DME doesn't get decrypted soon. really it comes down to the eisenmann race, eisenmann sport both with centerpipes or the akra. i've heard rumors that the DME has been decrypted and if that's the case i'll go downpipes and akra with a tune.
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      04-16-2014, 10:24 AM   #9
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Well the X5M has a readily breakable ECU for "real" tuning vs the not so perfect tunes on the F10 M5 (resistor tunes ala juice box style). So you are first off getting the full compliment of the boost adjusted with the tune and the tq feel is probably what you are feeling down low. Further, the tune most likely adapted your throttle input so the boost is on with a short press (accelerator) vs the oem press on the M5. So couple that with the tq and hp bump and I can see why you will feel that the car is quicker down low. But the X5M doesn't have a DCT and as said above weighs much more so when once you are in a rolling race the stock M5 will still pull IMHO.

I have the similar feel with my SL63 (tuned to almost 675 wheel tq) vs my stock Porsche TT-S. The SL just feels like it pulls better because of all the immediate tq down low but I know which is the faster car. The Pcar revs higher and its tq peaks around 5k but the hp keeps climbing much past that number so while I know Im faster I don't necessarily feel that way.
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      04-16-2014, 10:33 AM   #10
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I can see how the X5M feels stronger.
With my un-tuned X5M I managed to cut one 1.7XX and many mid low 1.8XX 60 foot times at the track. I can imagine with a tune you would constantly cut 1.7XX's. With the M5 you are only going to achieve those times with drag radials. More likely you will be cutting 2.0 to 2.2 60 foot times with the M5. But after the M5 hooks up it is all over, especially a CP car which is easily a 11.5 second car with proper traction. Also your trap speed with the tuned X5M is probably around 112 MPH where as an M5 CP is 124ish.
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      04-16-2014, 11:06 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northern X5M View Post
I can see how the X5M feels stronger.
With my un-tuned X5M I managed to cut one 1.7XX and many mid low 1.8XX 60 foot times at the track. I can imagine with a tune you would constantly cut 1.7XX's. With the M5 you are only going to achieve those times with drag radials. More likely you will be cutting 2.0 to 2.2 60 foot times with the M5. But after the M5 hooks up it is all over, especially a CP car which is easily a 11.5 second car with proper traction. Also your trap speed with the tuned X5M is probably around 112 MPH where as an M5 CP is 124ish.
+1

You saved me some time writing pretty much the same thing I was going to say.
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      04-16-2014, 11:12 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ray101381 View Post
totally agree with you, not looking for performance gains as acatback really doesn't do anything. i like the way downpipes and akra together sound but without a tune i won't do DP's. the akra alone is too quiet in my opinion. i'm leaning toward the eisenmann race or sport with centerpipes if the DME doesn't get decrypted soon. really it comes down to the eisenmann race, eisenmann sport both with centerpipes or the akra. i've heard rumors that the DME has been decrypted and if that's the case i'll go downpipes and akra with a tune.
Dude, I'm telling you there's no tune that takes away the CEL from Catless Downpipes and we still won't be getting one any time soon. Although I'd love to be proven wrong. As has been made aware recently, PP-Performance unofficially removed the top speed limiters from the F10 M5, this requires breaking of the encryption. The only other options are the BMS CEL CAN Tool, which is no longer for sale, or catted downpipes, which don't always guarantee no CEL, and they aren't necessarily louder or produce more power. I ran a with CEL for almost 20,000 miles on the F10 M5 and the only problem I had was the standard Drivetrain Malfunction, which you only get when your pushing the car too hard.

So like I said, my advice for exhaust is to either get the Eisenmann Race (best bang for the buck) or like you said about your neighbors, the Eisenmann Sport, which still does sound pretty good. The Akrapovic does sound very very good, but it's very tame and barely louder than the Comp Pack exhaust, which you have now. However, the Akra exhaust combined with Catless Downpipes is one of the BEST setups I have ever heard. I would recommend RPi , but their muffled systems are barely louder than stock also, and the GTM exhaust is retard loud, which I know is too much for you.

If you get just section 3 Eisenmann Race, you can't go wrong, as you still have the resonators too. Meistershaft does have the switchable valve also, so you can kind of control the loudness as well. Unfortunately where we live it's not like in Cali where you can hear all kinds of setups, so you just have to take our word for it.
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      04-27-2014, 10:33 PM   #13
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I have a '14 M5 CP and definitely felt a big change with the break in service... I asked the head service manager what they really do to the car... They take off a factory break in program that unlocks 75 more hp and then change fluids...Honest Truth, I have heard they do nothing much from prior peoples posts, but they do... Have fun after 1200...
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      04-28-2014, 11:37 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greentrbo95gst View Post
It depends what you are looking for, you can have slightly louder car with mild performance gains, much louder car with mild performance gains, stupid sounding car with no performance gains. I won't name the names, but most of you know the brands associated with each option. At the end of the day, you should know that you are not buying an exhaust for performance reasons in the M5. BMW engineers did a very good job at maximizing the performance of the stock exhaust with enough airflow to eliminate any possible doubts about upgrading. I ran 11.3 with OEM exhaust and tires so hopefully that tells you something.
11.3 r you serious?
Zero to 60?
Trap?
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      04-28-2014, 11:40 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by soooma View Post
11.3 r you serious?
Zero to 60?
Trap?
Just improved last weekend. 11.07@128
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      04-28-2014, 01:04 PM   #16
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Just improved last weekend. 11.07@128
Yeah but that's after mods! DP's and what else?
Yours is CP, right?
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      04-28-2014, 01:07 PM   #17
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Yeah but that's after mods! DP's and what else?
Yours is CP, right?
only added exhaust since the last run.
Non CP.
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      04-28-2014, 01:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Jeff View Post
I have a '14 M5 CP and definitely felt a big change with the break in service... I asked the head service manager what they really do to the car... They take off a factory break in program that unlocks 75 more hp and then change fluids...Honest Truth, I have heard they do nothing much from prior peoples posts, but they do... Have fun after 1200...
Is this true? My dealer in the uk says that's not the case. There must be something from bmw HQ that can tell us once and for all...
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      04-28-2014, 03:02 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.Jeff
I have a '14 M5 CP and definitely felt a big change with the break in service... I asked the head service manager what they really do to the car... They take off a factory break in program that unlocks 75 more hp and then change fluids...Honest Truth, I have heard they do nothing much from prior peoples posts, but they do... Have fun after 1200...
@RPiM5 the M5 is full of mysteries - break-in service and encrypted ECU.

By the way, I think PP Perf's delimit is not a tune (but I hope it is) and therefore not a broken through ECU. It's just a CD. Did you hear about the CD? LOL!
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      04-28-2014, 06:48 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPiM5 View Post
The only other options are the BMS CEL CAN Tool, which is no longer for sale, or catted downpipes, which don't always guarantee no CEL, and they aren't necessarily louder or produce more power.
My modified OEM catted DPs have never thrown a CEL on my F10 M5 or my F12 M6 and they produce a LOT ore power.
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      04-28-2014, 07:48 PM   #21
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Quote:
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My modified OEM catted DPs have never thrown a CEL on my F10 M5 or my F12 M6 and they produce a LOT ore power.
My Supersprint catless DPs, with midpipe 200 cell cats and micro cats lasted one day before throwing a CEL. That was a very expensive experiment.

With the E-Race muffs the drone is brutal below 2000 RPM. Fun but brutal. I think I will try reinstalling the factory resonators. Also, my neighbours are going to kill me I think. The cold start is insane, but I do love the turbo whistle now.

I could not imagine catless DPs and no muffs. LOL.
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      04-29-2014, 09:53 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Northern X5M View Post
My Supersprint catless DPs, with midpipe 200 cell cats and micro cats lasted one day before throwing a CEL. That was a very expensive experiment.

With the E-Race muffs the drone is brutal below 2000 RPM. Fun but brutal. I think I will try reinstalling the factory resonators. Also, my neighbours are going to kill me I think. The cold start is insane, but I do love the turbo whistle now.

I could not imagine catless DPs and no muffs. LOL.

I messed around with the cold start because of my neighbors and this is what I do:
Foot on the brake, start the car and have your foot on the accelerator to where it holds the revs at 2k rpm. Much quieter start. Hold it there for 10 seconds and then release. Let me know if that works.
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