[octaveshift]

It appears (to me, a layman) that the JB is just an electronic version of a
MBC....

I assume there is some sort of difference that I haven't considered?

[Evo8MRto335I]

The electronic boost controllers are variable and operated by the driver, I am not sure is the Juice box can change the boost to the driver's desire.

[DBville]

MBCs or EBCs control boost only. JB (and others) supposedly control timing and fuel as well. Going up more than a little in boost only, without managing timing and fuel could lead to problems. Depends on how much flexibility is in the OEM gear. It is very expensive to find out.

[BoostedBMW]

Originally Posted by DBville

MBCs or EBCs control boost only. JB (and others) supposedly control timing and fuel as well. Going up more than a little in boost only, without managing timing and fuel could lead to problems. Depends on how much flexibility is in the OEM gear. It is very expensive to find out.

I know that it ups boost and fuel, but as far as I know it doesn't control timing, which is why a lot of people, including myself, would never consider it.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by DBville

MBCs or EBCs control boost only. JB (and others) supposedly control timing and fuel as well.

The JB2 goes to 11.5psi, about 3 psi over stock. The JB2 lets the stock map handle the timing and fuel for this up to a certain RPM. At that point, regardless of conditions, the JB2 makes the ECU think things are running lean, so ECU adds fuel.

[sambonator]

Originally Posted by zenmaster

The JB2 goes to 11.5psi, about 3 psi over stock. The JB2 lets the stock map handle the timing and fuel for this up to a certain RPM. At that point, regardless of conditions, the JB2 makes the ECU think things are running lean, so ECU adds fuel.

JB1 and SSTT increase boost only, allowing the stock ECU to make timing and fuel adjustments to compensate. JB2 adds an additional compensation for fuel, more than for which the stock ECU map is programmed.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by sambonator

JB1 and SSTT increase boost only, allowing the stock ECU to make timing and fuel adjustments to compensate. JB2 adds an additional compensation for fuel, more than for which the stock ECU map is programmed.

That is correct.

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by BoostedBMW

I know that it ups boost and fuel, but as far as I know it doesn't control timing, which is why a lot of people, including myself, would never consider it.

+1 it relies on the ECU to make adjustments.It basically tricks the car into thinking it's always in a High Altidude situation.Which is why I don't consider Terry a "Tuner".

[A418t81]

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

+1 it relies on the ECU to make adjustments.It basically tricks the car into thinking it's always in a High Altidude situation.Which is why I don't consider Terry a "Tuner".

Wrong, there's absolutely no "high altitude" situation created by the JB, thats total BS. And every piggyback relies on the ECU to "make adjustments." If it were making all "adjustments" it wouldn't be a piggyback, it would be a standalone. The JB2 does not induce an offset on the crank trigger and influence timing directly like the xede, etc.

[alby on boost]

good info.

hey A418t81,

it seems like a lot of people are switchin over from the evo to the 335.

how does it compare?

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by A418t81

Wrong, there's absolutely no "high altitude" situation created by the JB, thats total BS. And every piggyback relies on the ECU to "make adjustments." If it were making all "adjustments" it wouldn't be a piggyback, it would be a standalone. The JB2 does not induce an offset on the crank trigger and influence timing directly like the xede, etc.

Thats strange thats what Terry Himself said a few months back but ok.

[Noize]

Originally Posted by A418t81

The JB2 does not induce an offset on the crank trigger and influence timing directly like the xede, etc.

Hence its like an SAFC + EBC without end user interface. No timing control on a $47,000 BMW? Screw that.

[e90AW335i]

Originally Posted by alby on boost

hey A418t81,

it seems like a lot of people are switchin over from the evo to the 335.

how does it compare?

[hotrod2448]

I would say that the effect is similar to that of an MBC. In that in one way way or another it raises boost. It goes about doing it in a different way than an MBC does though.

If I understand correctly it is basically just a few resistors that makes the ECU think it is at a lower boost level than it really is. If 12psi of boost is normally 5 volts output this resistor bleeds off X volts to make it think it's only at 8 psi.

What it doesn't do to my understanding (besides control ignition timing) is take RPM into account. It is just trying to turn up the boost and increase fuel by X amount regardless of what RPM the engine is turning. Which is like an MBC and not ideal.

[A418t81]

Originally Posted by Noize

Hence its like an SAFC + EBC without end user interface. No timing control on a $47,000 BMW? Screw that.

It obviously works as well as the ones with timing control, maybe even better since the consistency is there with considerably less boost.

[Lee Rambler]

and no limp modes....

[Beer Goggles]

Originally Posted by Noize

Hence its like an SAFC + EBC without end user interface. No timing control on a $47,000 BMW? Screw that.

The car has timing control, so why mess with that if not needed? None of the current choices are really "tuner" the piggy backs on other cars, allow everything to be controlled and tuned individually, which is not happening currently with the tuning for this engine.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

The car has timing control, so why mess with that if not needed?

For example, my old car had a margin of like .5 psi in the stock map. Running a catless downpipe, you'd blow the engine without first reprogramming the map. That simple.

So if you're running on the edge of the stock map, which means effectively using the safety margin, it's not a good thing - because now that margin is no longer available.

[Sherhart]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

The car has timing control, so why mess with that if not needed?

You obviously don't know how power is made....

[hotrod2448]

Originally Posted by Beer Goggles

The car has timing control, so why mess with that if not needed? None of the current choices are really "tuner" the piggy backs on other cars, allow everything to be controlled and tuned individually, which is not happening currently with the tuning for this engine.

On both the Procede and the Exede you can control boost, spark and fuel all independently of one another. It's just none of the tuners are giving the end user the ability to do it.

Most likely to prevent dumb asses who think they know what they are doing from screwing with the map then claiming "Brand X's piggy back blew my motor."

As far as the "why mess with ignition timing argument" goes it's a simple answer because, that's part of how you make power.

[Jeff@Eurobahn.us]

Originally Posted by sambonator

JB1 and SSTT increase boost only, allowing the stock ECU to make timing and fuel adjustments to compensate. JB2 adds an additional compensation for fuel, more than for which the stock ECU map is programmed.

To be accurate, the Turbo Tuner does slightly modify the IAT signal which does have the DME add additional fueling under certain circumstances and boost pressures.

Jeff
Eurobahn

[A418t81]

Originally Posted by Jeff@Eurobahn.us

To be accurate, the Turbo Tuner does slightly modify the IAT signal which does have the DME add additional fueling under certain circumstances and boost pressures.

Jeff
Eurobahn

Jeff, I find it odd that this is the case considering the connector, which no doubt is the TT strong point as far as install, contains no such circuit for intake air temperature data...making its modification dubious at best. Please provide us with a wiring diagram or some other modality of proof, if you don't mind.