[rambino]

Im a little concerned with running Procede v2.0 with the stock downpipes. Ive heard one horror story where someone stated they melted their cats causing engine damage and also from the read out below stating the stock DPs are not very good.

I live in Germany where everything must be Govt approved, and although I am using the Unapproved chip, im worried about my stock DPs melting and causing a major issue esp with holding high rpms at high speeds for a long period of time.. I would like to change them with High Flow cats but if I get caught with unathorized non-TUV approved ones I will have big issues and fines, so im better of keeping it stock..

Can anyone give me their opinion or ease my woes on this issue?


http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=87018

"It's easy to get more boost but for a tuner it's not always simple to do it under all conditions - at cold start, when hot and at altitude, for example. And there's a problem with the exhaust downpipe. With more power it gets very hot and will break.""

[OpenFlash]

I haven't heard of any melting cat stories. What horror story are you referring to?

shiv

[rambino]

The one that was on 6speedonline with the guys uncle. Not sure if it was a true or not story but it had me thinking, and with that article read from the tech it also kept me concerned. I know with all that beautiful HP coming out of the tail, it would seem like the Stock DPs might not be able to flow it thru so well and this would become a possible future issue..

Im just a little concerned and so im asking ... Have you any ideas or research which might put away my worries?

Thanks

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by rambino

The one that was on 6speedonline with the guys uncle. Not sure if it was a true or not story but it had me thinking, and with that article read from the tech it also kept me concerned. I know with all that beautiful HP coming out of the tail, it would seem like the Stock DPs might not be able to flow it thru so well and this would become a possible future issue..

Im just a little concerned and so im asking ... Have you any ideas or research which might put away my worries?

Thanks

That uncle story, from what I could tell, was completely fabricated. He never provided me any customer information like he said he would. Complete nonsense.

Shiv

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by rambino

The one that was on 6speedonline with the guys uncle. Not sure if it was a true or not story but it had me thinking, and with that article read from the tech it also kept me concerned. I know with all that beautiful HP coming out of the tail, it would seem like the Stock DPs might not be able to flow it thru so well and this would become a possible future issue..

Im just a little concerned and so im asking ... Have you any ideas or research which might put away my worries?

Thanks

That dude was queer he didn't even provide proof,pics, no contact info for Shiv nothing and melting the cats would require seriously rich AFR's and extreme EGT's something that pretty much NO one has experienced on ANY tune so far not even the little dinky JB..SO no worries dont' let that tool scare you away with that worthless thread his story didn't even make sense.All he said was "The cats melted and Procede caused it because the dealer said so..." right

[rambino]

Well regardless of that 6speed Story, the tech read out says it could be an issue, and on the German Forums for the 335 ive also read posts of people saying the Stock Downpipe is not to good and will overheat with extra high HP..

This post is to become more informed not to make an issue. Im truely concerned and was hoping someone could shed some more light on this..

[533ogetnom]

Originally Posted by rambino

Well regardless of that 6speed Story, the tech read out says it could be an issue, and on the German Forums for the 335 ive also read posts of people saying the Stock Downpipe is not to good and will overheat with extra high HP..

This post is to become more informed not to make an issue. Im truely concerned and was hoping someone could shed some more light on this..

for those who dont know this is what hes refering to (in the future when making claims like that sight the source please )


http://www.eurotuner.com/featuredveh...mw_335i_coupe/


"It's "easy to get more boost but for a tuner it's not always simple to do it under all conditions - at cold start, when hot and at altitude, for example. And there's a problem with the exhaust downpipe. With more power it gets very hot and will break."

"Coupe's Powertrain Project Manager, Udo Lindner,"




however i would take it with a grain of salt, im sure procede raises EGTs, but i dont to the extent that would "break" the downpipes

Originally Posted by rambino

Well regardless of that 6speed Story, the tech read out says it could be an issue, and on the German Forums for the 335 ive also read posts of people saying the Stock Downpipe is not to good and will overheat with extra high HP..

im sure what you read was based off that article and nothing more

[BzzzBom]

"It's "easy to get more boost but for a tuner it's not always simple to do it under all conditions - at cold start, when hot and at altitude, for example. And there's a problem with the exhaust downpipe. With more power it gets very hot and will break."

"Coupe's Powertrain Project Manager, Udo Lindner

I don't think we should take Mr. Linder's statement with a grain of salt.

[rambino]

So there has been hype from others and techs and german forums stating the stock DPs are not so good, and i doubt they were designed for 400HP.. so i do see this as a possible future problem.

[Hegemony]

There was a thread here where a guy took a blow torch to his cats. I think he posted pictures too. No damage.

Also, I just can't get past the irony of a guy who's self title is "Rape your car!" being potentially concerned about the possible down the road issue of higher temps on the downpipes.

[scottp999]

I don't think your downpipes are going to have a problem at 400. I think this is overblown. I am sick of these thread titles that mention a great product and destruction of a car parts failing or warranty being revoked. The procede has been extremley reliable and I don't lose a seconds sleep over having it in my car, and won't worry about v2 either.

[RiXst3r]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

That uncle story, from what I could tell, was completely fabricated. He never provided me any customer information like he said he would. Complete nonsense.

Shiv

Does your car still have its stock downpipes? Are they melted?

[Bimmer335i07]

OP if you are so concerned, don't mod your car. Just leave it stock.

[Maestro]

Let see the pipes are made of steel and do you know what temp it takes to melt steel...(1538 degrees Celsius if you did not know).

Come on people use your common sense here, To produce that kind of heat the heads would melt first since they are made of aluminum (660.32 degree Celsius melting point if you did not know)

I think the biggest issue if you run full out, the pipes will become weak form the continuous heat and cooling and if you live in an environment with lots of moisture in the air your pipes will rust very fast and disintegrates

[E90ice]

[leftcoastman]

Originally Posted by Maestro

Let see the pipes are made of steel and do you know what temp it takes to melt steel...(1538 degrees Celsius if you did not know).

Come on people use your common sense here, To produce that kind of heat the heads would melt first since they are made of aluminum (660.32 degree Celsius melting point if you did not know)

I think the biggest issue if you run full out, the pipes will become weak form the continuous heat and cooling and if you live in an environment with lots of moisture in the air your pipes will rust very fast and disintegrates

Correct me if I'm wrong, but i'm not sure it's quite that simple. The pipes may be made of steel but the welds/crimps are the weak links. Additionally, who knows how the catalyst material heats up when subjected to constant high temps. And I'm no car engineer, but 1500deg doesn't sound that hot when talking about combustion temps.

And the head is not exactly an analogue. The heads are cooled by coolant and possibly oil, are they not?

That said, I haven't seen any stock DP issues, except for the fact that they add lag, lol.

[Riss Racing]

I can tell you the stock DP are junk. But I don't see them being melted by Procede V2.

[ZBMW]

Someone here posted observations taken over a period of several days using an electronic device which measured, among other things. boost pressure, on his 335i with Procede. The actual percentage of time the engine reached overboost was less then 5% and the time at max boost was even less. Logically, those seem like typical figures. I mean, we don't drive around all day at WOT. So, unless someone is driving on the Ohio test track with his foot in it all the way around, you would be at full boost for only the time it takes to get up to speed, even if you are on the Autobahn.
I'm confident that BMW engineers made generous allowances for short term transient temperature extremes.
Both BMW and Vishnu allow the petrol/air mixture to tend to the rich side, which keeps things cool all the way to the cats. Recall the British 12 hour race and the reliability Shiv got out of those little Mitsu's.

[jon@themshop]

When I had the PROcede I did about ten 5-7 seconds wide open throttle runs, exit off the freeway, when into the parking lot and opened up the hood and my exhaust was glowing! Obviously this is normal but I wonder how long can Rambino's 335i last if he's on the Autobahn on wide open throttle for more than 15 seconds a few times a week.

I think this can even happen if the 335i is bone stock but may have to be on the throttle longer.

If there's an increase of power then isn't there an increase of EGTs?

[jon@themshop]

Originally Posted by ZBMW

Recall the British 12 hour race and the reliability Shiv got out of those little Mitsu's.

Yes but don't forget that the race 335i also had no cats. The decrease in back pressure puts less stress on the turbines.

[Dr_Dirt]

I used to have EGT gauges on my other car and the redline on the gauges started at 900C.
The highest I could get them to was 950C.
Now keep in mind that the EGT gauge is measuring temp on the exhaust manifold before the turbos. The heat of the exhaust on the outlet side leaving the turbos is significantly less than the exhaust manifold.
Whatever the EGT's read, the downpipe should see less.

Do we have any current EGT data to see what temps we are running

[jon@themshop]

Originally Posted by Dr_Dirt

I used to have EGT gauges on my other car and the redline on the gauges started at 900C.
The highest I could get them to was 950C.
Now keep in mind that the EGT gauge is measuring temp on the exhaust manifold before the turbos. The heat of the exhaust on the outlet side leaving the turbos is significantly less than the exhaust manifold.
Whatever the EGT's read, the downpipe should see less.

Do we have any current EGT data to see what temps we are running

Did you have to drill on the manifold to insert the probe or was it some sort of thermocoupler you attached?