[Motorama]

I'm looking to buy an '07-'10 6MT E90 335i (sport package preferably) so I've been doing my research while looking at a couple of cars.

A good friend of mine has an '07 E92 335i that he bought almost new, currently at around 60k miles and while he really likes his car, he's told me that it's the most unreliable BMW that he's owned so far among the many that he and his family have owned (HPFP, injectors, coils, self leveling headlights, oil leaks, etc). Because of the many known issues with these cars, he recommends against buying one that isn't CPO.

If not buying a CPO E90, my other alternative would be to buy an outside extended warranty for it. I'm a previous owner of many years of an E36 M3 and MCoupe before so I was expecting at least the same reliability levels as those. Are there any particular prod dates that I should avoid or more desirable mechanical updates to keep in mind aside from cosmetic on this year range?

Thank you.

[SHEEDI]

Avoid 07 And 08, Start Looking From 09, i have owned this car since last november and i dont have any issues.

[smallseafishie]

HPFP is pretty much resolved with the updated pumps (notoriously bad on 07 and 08 models). All of those should have been swapped out with the recall so you should be good to go on any 07 or 08.

The other difference between 07 and 08 models are the wastegate on the turbo improved on the newer models to minimize rattle.

Oil leaks around oil filter housing is pretty simple to replace yourself.

09 and newer had the nicer navigation units.

[ThEnder]

I have a 2010 and did have an issue with my adaptive light controller on the driver side but it was covered under warranty. Other than that, it's only been in for oil changes and an inspection.

I'd narrow the search to 2009 and 2010, then you get the LCI updates which make the E90 look much better IMO. You also have the benefit of the 2-3 years of tweaks they made to the N54 to increase reliability.

[ctuna]

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...t=disappointed
E46 has a simpler design and is more solid in my opinion.
Only three problems on mine basically three sensors got replaced in 8 years.


Lots of cheapening going on from 2010 on.
Beware of the base stereo on the 2010's and early 2011's its real crap.

The trouble with turbo's and DI injection is the main problem though the non turbo's have a few funky problems to.

There is a review in the current road an track or car an driver saying the new
F30 is even worse. ( Or at least they like the e90 better when equipped near the same.)

[GarlicBread]

Early 335s have many problems. You see a lot less in lci versions but still not the same reliability level than what you had before IMO. why not look at a used m3 if you need the speed and if not then the 328s are more reliable

[benzo23]

go 09+ with cpo

[kavadarci]

as someone who owns e90 lci 2009 I would STRONGLY recommend not to touch these cars without warranty.
Things WILL go bust, no question about it, sometimes multiple times.
It's a money pit machine, don't don't don't touch it without warranty.
Even if you are handy man, parts are extremely expensive and these cars are pain to work on.

I don't care how much people love these cars (I love mine) these are not reliable cars and require regular repairs.
If you take my advise you will be one happy camper.
it's your money at the end.

Cheers.

[Motorama]

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm going to start looking into the cost of buying a warranty if I end up buying a non-CPO car.

I'm currently looking at a '07 with under 20k miles and a couple of '09s with around 40s-50s k miles. One of the '09s has one month left on its factory warranty and the asking price on the '07 is higher than the other 2 because of its mileage and mods.

I understand that the oil coolers were only installed on sport package equipped cars from '08 & up correct? How expensive / difficult is it to install on cars that didn't come equipped with them from factory?

Thanks.

[thenewrick]

Sport oil coolers are on the 07 335i coupes as well, dunno bout sedans

[Motorama]

I've narrowed it down to three E90s so far:

1st - '07, 20k miles, sport and Cold Weather Packages, Parking Sensors. BMS JB4 Stage 3, BMS Dual Cone Intake, CP-E Downpipes, Avant Garde 19 inch Staggered Wheels. No warranty.

2nd - '08, 35k miles, sport package, comfort access, heated seats. 9 mos. left on CPO warranty.

3rd - '09, 46k miles, sport & cold packages. 1 mos left on factory warranty.

The '07 is around $1 - $2k higher than the other two but has the extras & low miles. The price difference could be greater if I can get the dealers to include extended warranties on either the '08 or '09 at no extra cost.

Thanks.

[thegrinchboy]

Originally Posted by Motorama

I've narrowed it down to three E90s so far:

1st - '07, 20k miles, sport and Cold Weather Packages, Parking Sensors. BMS JB4 Stage 3, BMS Dual Cone Intake, CP-E Downpipes, Avant Garde 19 inch Staggered Wheels. No warranty.

2nd - '08, 35k miles, sport package, comfort access, heated seats. 9 mos. left on CPO warranty.

3rd - '09, 46k miles, sport & cold packages. 1 mos left on factory warranty.

The '07 is around $1 - $2k higher than the other two but has the extras & low miles. The price difference could be greater if I can get the dealers to include extended warranties on either the '08 or '09 at no extra cost.

Thanks.

While the mods are nice, I would have some concerns on car #1 with no warranty, you never know what the previous owner(s) did or did not do with the car and if he/she knew what they were doing...

Then again the same could be said for #2 or #3 which may potentially had the mods removed, but at least there is some warranty left... Just my 2 cents worth...

Good luck!

[Motorama]

For what is worth, the '07 is a 1 owner car & I believe that he had the parts professionally installed. The other 2 cars had at least 2 owners each.

Thanks!

[F-16 CHIEF]

I was in the same boat as you are. I ended up with an 09 with CPO for 2 more years. I'm in it for under 20K, so if it's garbage, I'll dump it in Nov of 2015 when the CPO runs out. I read the horror stories as well.

So far, I love it. Down the road, we shall see.

[Motorama]

I found a low miles 6MT '09 M package 335i. It's just been CPO'd with coverage 'til 9/'15. It's gonna be fun to drive her back home.

[Gbiz]

If you haven't bought a 335i yet, I know of one in your area that could be for sale

[racermp]

Buy stock 09. Don't buy modded

[*LongFella]

Getting the CPO coverage is key IMO. I got a 2007 328i e90 N52 that was covered up to 100k. It has 110k now and it is still running strong. We made the Dealer service the car every 5-7k intervals... So I'm hoping to get another 100k out of it. It helps I have the title and own it too

[bahasad]

If you're going with the 335 models, avoid early models and ones with too high mileage imo. Once you get up there in miles you're going to be looking at $$$ repair costs for sure.
If you're looking for a relatively reliable, comparably lower maintenance cost E90, get a 328I, which is what I bought. My one has a warranty (which you should definitely look for) until the end of the year on top of money I have aside for repairs. Just don't drive a 335I before you do.

[Motorama]

The fact that it seems to be an unmolested 1 owner '09 with around 30k miles that it just got CPO'd sealed the deal for me (some type of warranty was key for me). The M package, its space gray metallic color & adding that it has lived all of its life in a southern state (no salt exposure) was just gravy.

If she really ends up being in the great condition that I was told that she is, the 1400 mile drive back home should give me plenty of time to enjoy her & drive her the way Bimmers are supposed to be driven.

[tony20009]

Originally Posted by Motorama

...
A good friend of mine has an '07 E92 335i ... Because of the many known issues with these cars, he recommends against buying one that isn't CPO.

Your friend is a good one. He gave you good advice. You'd do well to heed that advice if it is a foregone conclusion that you are going to buy a 335i of some sort or other. I would add too that if you are buying a 335i, buy the newest one you can find with the fewest miles on it. Even if it's not your favorite color combination and doesn't have just the options you may think you want. Several years down the road, you'll appreciate that you bought yourself the better used car rather than having bought the better options and paint colors because then, although you may pine for this or that color or option, complaining about that is far better than paying to fix things and having the complaints that result from having to do so.

Not that you asked, but were I to seek a used BMW, it'd be a 328i I go for. The speed, power and torque of the 335 is intoxicatingly, addictively wonderful to behold and feel every time you get in the car. It's not worth the risk, however, if one is buying a used car. Were you thinking of buying a new 335i, I wouldn't advise you not to.

The is one potential exception to the CPO admonishment, and I say "potential" because I don't think it a wise choice to make, but it's best way to go if one is going to buy a non-CPO car. Sometimes, a BMW dealer will have a used car available that is one year old or newer, and that has fewer than 10K miles on it. They will offer it for sale as a non-CPO used car. They do this because to sell it with the CPO coverage will make them bump the price up a one to two grand. If they bump the price up a couple grand or so, the car will compete in price with a new car. With such a car, however, you can generally either buy the new car extended warranty and maintenance program or you can pay to have them assign CPO status to it.

(The price you pay for that coverage is negotiable, so just make sure you include it in your requirements, and make sure that the dealer understands that any offer you make to them includes the price of the extended warranty/CPO coverage. As far as what that coverage really costs them, I can tell you that now: $0.00. What they'll charge you for it has everything to do with what they think it's worth to you, the buyer. As it does have value to a buyer, one generally cannot expect to just get it for free, though some folks may have done.)

Originally Posted by Motorama

If not buying a CPO E90, my other alternative would be to buy an outside extended warranty for it. I'm a previous owner of many years of an E36 M3 and MCoupe before so I was expecting at least the same reliability levels as those. Are there any particular prod dates that I should avoid or more desirable mechanical updates to keep in mind aside from cosmetic on this year range?

Thank you.

If you have bought one of those "outside provider" extended warranties before and used it and been happy with the outcome of having done so, OK. Everything I've read about them suggests that they are a huge waste of money. It's my understanding that the terms of such warranties are written so that the car would nearly have to just fall apart into thousands of pieces right while standing still in front of you and a witness in order for the warranty company to actually pay you (or the repair facility) something. I've also heard of repair facilities not honoring/accepting the warranty, making you pay for the repairs, and then you have to collect from the warranty company.

I'm sure there are legit third-party warranties and warranty companies out there, but inasmuch as the issue of fraud among those companies has reached the level whereby the FTC has deigned to have something to say about, I advise just not even going that route.

All the best and good luck.

EDIT:
Re: third party warranties, read this: http://www.edmunds.com/auto-warranty...nty-scams.html

[RallyRcrr]

Originally Posted by Motorama

Thanks for all the feedback. I'm going to start looking into the cost of buying a warranty if I end up buying a non-CPO car.

I'm currently looking at a '07 with under 20k miles and a couple of '09s with around 40s-50s k miles. One of the '09s has one month left on its factory warranty and the asking price on the '07 is higher than the other 2 because of its mileage and mods.

I understand that the oil coolers were only installed on sport package equipped cars from '08 & up correct? How expensive / difficult is it to install on cars that didn't come equipped with them from factory?

Thanks.

Motorama, you touched on a big issue for the 335 that was fixed in later versions of the N54 motor. You definitely want to find with an oil cooler because the 335 had a limp home mode that is directly tied to oil temps going above 290F. The engine will go into a lower power mode until the temps go back to a temp the computer considers safe. The problem with the early models is that it is easy to go into that safe mode when the motor is not equipped with an oil cooler.

Typical Temps for my non-oil cooler 335xi
Without an oil cooler on my 2007 335xi this is what I've seen. (For all trolls yes this is driver and environment dependant; you temps may vary) Normal operating temps for me hover between 230-250F. Spirited mountain runs can shoot into the 270-280F range. Track days will run well into the 290+ and limp home range.

Pacific Raceways Washington State
During a sport lapping day I recently took, I found my car consistently bumping into the temp limp home mode. It didn't last long, but it took up to a lap to bring my temps down. Track sessions run about 1 1/2 hrs long and that's more than enough to bring the motor past its limit and keep it there. My needle was well into the 290-300 range. I can't tell exactly where it cut off since this was a by the analog needle reading. Next time I'll go to the track with an ODB recorder. This track is particularly brutal on the motor temps because of its long main straight. My 335 would reach just under 140mph when I got the exit to the main straight just right. For reference my car does not have an OEM oil cooler. I plan to fix that soon. I bought a VK oil cooler kit from another member, but haven't installed it yet because I didn't know about the need for a retro fit kit before I bought it. (I went on a spending spree when I first got my 335 and didn't do the research before hand)

Non-Oil vs Oil-Cooler-Equipped
So how do you tell? Look at the pictures below. You'll see right by the oil filter that the motor has a couple of lines coming out of it. These lines lead straight to the oil cooler. No lines no oil cooler. You can see a direct comparison photo I found from another e90 member.

Oil Cooler Options
If you never plan to do anything than daily driver your kids to school, then by all means go without an oil cooler. If you enjoy spirited drives but never track find a 335 with an OEM cooler and you should be ok. If your spirited drives are the kind that make the turbos and brakes glow orange, or if you track your car, get a 335 with an OEM cooler AND upgrade to an aftermarket oil cooler. Of the aftermarket choices there are three styles available; side mount, front mount, dual side mount. The OEM for the US is a side mount. After market tuners such as VK, Evolution Racewerks, Dinan, etc. typically do a higher rated side mount which offer twice the cooling of the OEM unit. The front mount sold by turner is less common and usually seen in Europe and cools about the same as the side; though some people argue that its front mount location gets cooler air. Below is a pic from the e46, I couldn't find where I put the photo I found of another member doing a front mount. If neither of those still satisfy you, Evolution Raceworks offers a full competition kit with a dual oil cooler setup. The beauty of this system is its massive cooling capacity. ER says the OEM unit has 41 cubit inches versus 144 of theirs in cooling capacity. They claim to have completely cured limp home caused by temps. I plan to put them to the test later this year.

I hope this answers some of the questions you may have. I do want to note that the 335i is noted to have some teething issues, but it is generally believed that a motor that has had warranty work for the hpfp and other tech bulletin updates along with an oil cooler are considered to be just as reliable as other motors BMW has made. The motor itself is very sturdy and can handle plenty of power upgrades without the need to open up the block.

Below I attached some pictures and links of some of the notes I mentioned above:

Side by Side comparison
Close up of Oil Cooler equipped Oil Housing
Dinan Oil Cooler (same design as VK). $2500. http://www.dinancars.com/shop/D570-0...il-cooler.aspx
Dinan vs OEM Comparison.
ER Competition Oil Cooler kit. http://www.evolutionracewerks.com/?q=node/133
Eurostyle Front Mount from Turner Motorsports. $1500. http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-15...il-cooler.aspx

Dinan Oil Cooler Review
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=254703