[TSM330i]

This topic became some pretty popular on another thread so I decided to start its own thread.

There is a forum that is dedicated to the LS series of GM engines called LS1tech.com.
On the website, there's a board for conversions & hybrids. Of course the vast majority are older muscle cars, but they do have some good information that may be helpful if someone would want to tackle such a project.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-hybrids-28/

It seems there are VERY few options when it comes to adding HP to our 325, 328 and 330 and even then, there are other issues that will creap up such as cooling.

The base LS engine started in 1997 with the LS1 in the Camaro and Corvette. It has an aluminum block and heads and has 345hp. They are a pushrod engine so the physical size of the engine is not very large due to DOHC. I really believe this engine would fit inside the e90 engine bay. I've seen an e30 with an LS engine installed so it's a start.

The LS series of engines is as follows (please feel free to add if I forgot any)
Of course there are other variations as well:
LS1: 305-350hp and 350-365ft lbs
LS6: 385-405hp and 385-400ft lbs
LS2: 400hp and 400ft lbs
LS3: 430-436hp and 424ft lbs
LS7: 505hp and 470ft lbs
LSA: 556-580hp and 551-556ft lbs
LS9: 638hp and 604ft lbs
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_LS_engine

New LS1 engines start at $5,200 and go up to about $20,000 for an LS9.
LS3 with a "hot" cam will put out 480hp and costs $6,600!
http://www.crateenginedepot.com/LS-S...ines-C943.aspx

On the same website above, you'll find a six-speed manual for $2800.

I know this is sacriliege to some, but the NA crowd is caught between a rock and a hard place when it comes to making HP. We are "hoping" for a supercharger that will give us about 350hp for under $6,000.
Yes, transmission strength is a question and a new clutch would be required for manual so those are possible added expenses.

I just wanted to start this to see if someone wanted to take the plunge.

http://www.youtube.com/results?hl=en...-8&sa=N&tab=w1

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...0l94l155l2l2l0

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...0l70l129l2l2l0

[Gavin@MMW]

I have seen the e30 your talking about, and they had an e36 M3 with an LS swap at Barrett Jackson a couple years back.

Id be interested to see it done by someone, I would never do it personally for a ton of reasons, mostly because a chevy motor doesn't need to be in my BMW lol

But from a customization standpoint, it would be pretty cool to see done.

[7e90dan]

Im suprised it hasnt been done yet. The ls engines are extremly durable and cheap to mod. A supercharger cost lesd than 7k installef and will put you close to 600hp on an ls6 or ls1. Which is the main reason im getting a c5 z06 to replace my e90

[RupertPupkin]

Rob,
I will volunteer my car. Buy me an LS7 and tranny and we can get started dropping it in!

[Beemw335]

I say sell your car and buy a c6.
No point of having all that power with the proper brakes, suspension, wheels, tires, lol you get what I mean.
Having a 323 with 500 hp isnt exactly a balanced car..

[mike-y]

of course you'd need to upgrade everything else on the car to be able to handle 400+ hp. If you have the money to do a conversion like this, you have the money to upgrade the other parts of the car.

Though there is a reason why you see people use older cars for conversions like this. It doesn't make as much sense on a newer car, but find an older E46/E36 and do the conversion, as well as brakes and suspension, and you'll spend a lot less in the long run, and still have a pretty badass car.

[TroyDeJ]

i would only do it to an e90 with a blown motor or a car with front end damage. no reason to kill a good working e90 when you can save one

[TroyDeJ]

i came across this: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...=662836&page=3

[E90 87ss]

Originally Posted by TroyDeJ

i came across this: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...=662836&page=3

You realize that the goal is for it to be cost effective. 20k+ and S65 wouldn't be a problem...

Rob your car is perfect for the swap, but the only way you could keep it under 7k is to do a lot of the fabrication/labor yourself. The engine/trans will have to be used though. + you could always sell your n52 + trans.

[axis]

With so much of the e90 being controlled by computers / modules and such, I don't think it would be an easy task at all to drop in another motor. For instance.. starting the car. I'm pretty sure the DME would see there was not a BMW motor in there, and nothing else would work that is electronic. Older BMWs were a bit more mechanical in that respect. I know you could get some sort of engine management to make the motor run, but I just don't know how it could talk to the rest of the car.

[Gjm127]

Sell yours and buy a used M3.. Converting your car to this extent will kill your car's balance, it would be dangerous and unstable. The clutch and gears on a non-turbo E9X can't handle that much power.. Our cars are built for the engines that are in it, you need stability to ensure safety and good performance. With this, you're largely messing with the cars base stability... trust me I'm (almost) an engineer... lol

[RupertPupkin]

Guys pretty sure OP isn't planning on doing this....or is he?

[RazRokz.!]

smh. American engine in a german car = no-go in my book...

[TroyDeJ]

buy a used e90 m3 and do a standard e90 body conversion and one sided exhaust conversion with 330 badges. everyone will think you put the m3 motor in the 330 but only we will know your secret

[spacemonkey1112]

Originally Posted by TroyDeJ

buy a used e90 m3 and do a standard e90 body conversion and one sided exhaust conversion with 330 badges. everyone will think you put the m3 motor in the 330 but only we will know your secret

hahaha what a silly way to blow money. I think if I had money to do something insane I'll put a k20a2 in a prius... no one will expect it...

[TSM330i]

Originally Posted by Gjm127

Sell yours and buy a used M3.. Converting your car to this extent will kill your car's balance, it would be dangerous and unstable. The clutch and gears on a non-turbo E9X can't handle that much power.. Our cars are built for the engines that are in it, you need stability to ensure safety and good performance. With this, you're largely messing with the cars base stability... trust me I'm (almost) an engineer... lol

LOL!
The funny thing is that I worked as a mechanical engineer for 14 years!

I'd change the entire driveline - engine, trans and rear end and look at beefing up the half-shafts.

As for balance, the LS series of engines are really light considering the cubic inches they displace. The LS7 has a dry-sump oiling system so I could retrofit that to keep the engine installed very low in the chassis. The most I'd have to do is maybe uprate my front springs, the rest should be really good.

As for the S65 V8 - I've looked extensively into this. It would take me purchasing an entire car that has been crashed (about $30K) and then pulling all the parts off that. Subtract all the parts I don't need and sell those, then add in all the labor and I'm looking at around $30-35,000 till all is said and done.

For me to sell my current 330 and do everything to an M3 that I have done to my car would cost me about $30-35,000! The main thing I DON'T like about the M3 is the weight. Once I get rid of my sunroof and install the carbon roof my car will be around 3,215lbs, so between 400-600lbs lighter than an M3. Even if the LS series engine add 100lbs, I'd still be way lighter. I am obsessed with lighter weight. Driving my car and feeling how effortless it is to change direction is addicting and I won't give that up.

If I could get an LS3 used with the trans and then come up with a solution for the rear end I could be into it for around $7,000 tops. Install a cam in the LS3 and I have about 480hp. I'm thinking this entire install would be $15-20,000. Possibly half of what it would cost to do an S65.

The computers would have to be run in tandem. I'd have to run the BMW computer to run all the cars electronics and the GM computer to run the engine. Getting the gauges to work may proove difficult and they may have to be run from the GM computer so something custom would be needed.

Without a doubt, this could be done. Anything is possible. It's just a matter if someone wants to actually do it.

[PINeely]

A man who I know has a Morgan Plus 8 with an LS3 in it. If it were going to be hard to fit an LS into any engine bay, that one would be it. Computer management will be the tricky part since you will need the BMW computer to run the electronics and a GM unit to run the engine. The two run in tandem may argue from time to time.

[PINeely]

Originally Posted by spacemonkey1112

hahaha what a silly way to blow money. I think if I had money to do something insane I'll put a k20a2 in a prius... no one will expect it...

Supercharged Honda Odyssey is my dream sleeper.

[mike-y]

LSx engines fit in mazda miatas, they are small! should be no problem getting one in an E9x. Getting it in the car is probably the easy part, compared to figuring out what to do with the car's electronics.

[spacemonkey1112]

Originally Posted by PINeely

Supercharged Honda Odyssey is my dream sleeper.

hahah our family previa was super charged hahaha my brother and I pulled away on a corolla with that thing on the 101 freeway at around 110mph! it was so hilarious!

[Johnny D]

Originally Posted by TSM330i

LOL!
The funny thing is that I worked as a mechanical engineer for 14 years!

I'd change the entire driveline - engine, trans and rear end and look at beefing up the half-shafts.

As for balance, the LS series of engines are really light considering the cubic inches they displace. The LS7 has a dry-sump oiling system so I could retrofit that to keep the engine installed very low in the chassis. The most I'd have to do is maybe uprate my front springs, the rest should be really good.

As for the S65 V8 - I've looked extensively into this. It would take me purchasing an entire car that has been crashed (about $30K) and then pulling all the parts off that. Subtract all the parts I don't need and sell those, then add in all the labor and I'm looking at around $30-35,000 till all is said and done.

For me to sell my current 330 and do everything to an M3 that I have done to my car would cost me about $30-35,000! The main thing I DON'T like about the M3 is the weight. Once I get rid of my sunroof and install the carbon roof my car will be around 3,215lbs, so between 400-600lbs lighter than an M3. Even if the LS series engine add 100lbs, I'd still be way lighter. I am obsessed with lighter weight. Driving my car and feeling how effortless it is to change direction is addicting and I won't give that up.

If I could get an LS3 used with the trans and then come up with a solution for the rear end I could be into it for around $7,000 tops. Install a cam in the LS3 and I have about 480hp. I'm thinking this entire install would be $15-20,000. Possibly half of what it would cost to do an S65.

The computers would have to be run in tandem. I'd have to run the BMW computer to run all the cars electronics and the GM computer to run the engine. Getting the gauges to work may proove difficult and they may have to be run from the GM computer so something custom would be needed.

Without a doubt, this could be done. Anything is possible. It's just a matter if someone wants to actually do it.

I dont see the weight savings you are stating. My estimation of weights.

A dressed LS motor with no A/C or power steering would be around 550lbs. Our n52 is 350lbs. Transmission the T-56 is around 130lbs and the ZF is around 95lbs. Drivetrain modifications to fit engine and transmission and body strengthening for the added torque (Yes you will need it) add another 100lbs. Harness and ECU and other misc items you need to run the LS motor another 50lbs. Want AC/power steering? Another 15-20lbs. Its going to add up...

Stock e92 m3 is 3700lbs
Your car 3215lbs + the 405lbs you gained in weight 3620lbs

No where near 400-600lbs...

With the kind of money youre talking about throwing out, I hope you gut the car and turn it into a full fledged trailer queen race car.

[TSM330i]

Originally Posted by jntar

I dont see the weight savings you are stating. My estimation of weights.

A dressed LS motor with no A/C or power steering would be around 550lbs. Our n52 is 350lbs. Transmission the T-56 is around 130lbs and the ZF is around 95lbs. Drivetrain modifications to fit engine and transmission and body strengthening for the added torque (Yes you will need it) add another 100lbs. Harness and ECU and other misc items you need to run the LS motor another 50lbs. Want AC/power steering? Another 15-20lbs. Its going to add up...

Stock e92 m3 is 3700lbs
Your car 3215lbs + the 405lbs you gained in weight 3620lbs

No where near 400-600lbs...

With the kind of money youre talking about throwing out, I hope you gut the car and turn it into a full fledged trailer queen race car.

Dressed LS3 is not over 500lbs. Also, is the 350lbs for the N52 fully dressed or just the engine? I can't find out if it's fully dressed or just the engine.

My car already has AC/power steering so it would be a wash, not additional weight.