[N55 Power]

I really dont know where to start on this one.
It has been such a wacky experience that its just really hard to explain.

Let me just tell you my story from the beginning and you be the judge.

I ordered a AR Design n55 downpipe from AR Design on the 5th of December. The reason why i chose them over Icarbon in the first Place i have no idea. Dealing with AR was a pain and let me tell you right now that Andrew is not the kind of guy who should be running a business. I fell sorry for anyone who has to go through the ordeal of having business with andrew.

Let me show you the kind of hoops i had to jump through just to communicate with AR Design.

I emailed AR Design 3 times and he replied once

I PM'd AR design 2 times and he didn't even reply once

I Posted on his thread 3 times and he didnt address my concerns once

And heres the kicker: I called him a whopping 27 times and he answered me only 3 of those times!

I have to admit he did upgrade me and others to overnight. But listen to this. I took my car apart installing this thing when i notice this very frustrating fact: He had forgot to put in the second o2 bung!! After all this he did not even take the time to check ONCE that the Downpipe was correctly made and even when i call him about that he doesnt admit that my car even needs the second bung and tells me to jury rig it!! Youve got to be kidding me.

I tried everything too return my useless dp from AR design but he would never return any of my calls I sent him after getting the dp. The way i see it his attitude is that once he gets your money and sends you whatever pipe he whips up that its your problem. I was forced to ship the thing back on MY DIME and get a credit card charge-back. Real professional.

I got such a bad taste in my mouth after this that i just called it quits on the mods, however that did not last long

I got the icarbon dp and it is much higher quality for a better price. I installed it today and im really impressed.

Overall the icarbon is better than Ar. Better welds,The tubing is mandrel bent and not cut to bend like Ar.

Fitment was good but needs improvement: 2nd bung should be farther away from the mount by maybe a quarter of an inch and the mounts need better alignment but thats it. The dp sounds amazing and the turbo whistle is almost as loud as a tuned diesel truck.

The thing that most impressed me about icarbon and hpautowerkes is that they followed a very important business rule: Underpromise and overdeliver.

I called hpautowerkes and they said my my pipe would ship out friday or monday but to my surprise it ARRIVED monday! Underpromising and overdelivering unlike AR Design who, as everyone knows said the pipes would ship out in 2-3 weeks from order when in fact they shiped out 3-4 weeks late. So closer to 5-7 weeks to get your pipe.


Bottom Line: IMO AR really isnt a nice place to do business with. His products are overrated.Hes focusing on looking good and not being good. He is too busy getting tape and boxes that have his logo on it. Icarbon and HPautowerkes on the other hand are good and i wish them both well.

Ill probably post up a video of the Icarbon and AA axelback combo that im running as there may be differences than the AR, seeing as people are only posting up videos of the AR dp.

Heres a pic for whatever reason:

[Nedim]

Glad you like the DP man! I was gonna go with AR but i went with the Active autowerke 3inch. It sounds amazing. didnt really get to test it out yet, there's a blizzard going on

[Brey335i]

You don't like AR's handling of selling downpipes? Imagine that situation when buying a big single turbo kit from them haha.

Usually AR gets great reviews for workmanship, although they sometimes take a bit of heat for customer service (I haven't seen any complaints lately though)... at the end of the day, if their product fits the best that's what people will buy

[e92sport]

Yea i went through the same thing... Horrible customer service.

[Proper Motion LLC]

Damn lol

[lpphreakx06]

Post this in the feedback forum.

[tscdennab]

I never liked AR's prices anyway and refused to pay a ripoff price, but I must tell you I encountered the same delays from Macht Schnell and one of their distributors with my coated 3" downpipes. There have been 5 weeks since I paid and I just received a note that they may have shipped yesterday (which I don't think so).

[Bimmer This]

I understand..........but brushed does not look like that. My brushed wheels look 100 times better.

[Mikey_Bo0sts]

Originally Posted by Bimmer This

I understand..........but brushed does not look like that. My brushed wheels look 100 times better.

Yeah brushed and clear coated and why would you compare PIPES and wheels, wheels are made to look good , pipes are made to work/fit good , I've seen these pipes in person and having AR dp's myself I must say these are amazing quality.

[N55 Power]

Originally Posted by Bimmer This

IMO, no way that iCarbon pipes look better then AR pipes. It looks like a cheap stainless steel tube that was painted silver.

I have held both in my hands and both are good but the Icarbon is definatly better. How it good it looks is subjective so really its a matter of opinion.

[Bimmer This]

Originally Posted by Mikey_Bo0sts

Yeah brushed and clear coated and why would you compare PIPES and wheels, wheels are made to look good , pipes are made to work/fit good , I've seen these pipes in person and having AR dp's myself I must say these are amazing quality.

so what was your reason for getting AR dp's?

[Bimmer This]

Originally Posted by N55 Power

I have held both in my hands and both are good but the Icarbon is definatly better. How it good it looks is subjective so really its a matter of opinion.

I agree that it is a matter of opinion. But, I sense that you only said that because you had a bad experience with the other company.

[Mikey_Bo0sts]

Originally Posted by Bimmer This

so what was your reason for getting AR dp's?

I got 'em waaaaaaay before Icarbon came out ;]

[N55 Power]

Originally Posted by Bimmer This

I agree that it is a matter of opinion. But, I sense that you only said that because you had a bad experience with the other company.

Like me an others have said the welds on the icarbon are better but i did also notice that one of the midpipes was potruding inside of the AR dp causing a restriction, this is not so on the icarbon.

[N55 Power]

Originally Posted by N55 Power

Like me an others have said the welds on the icarbon are better but i did also notice that one of the midpipes was potruding inside of the AR dp causing a restriction, this is not so on the icarbon.

Also i would like to add that on the icarbon the main tubing is a gradual mandral bend. On th AR he uses straight pipe but cuts it at angles to creat a bend, this causes very aggresive curves.not gradual like the icarbon. Look at a picture of the AR an youll see what i mean.

[Bimmer This]

Seriously, look again and seriously tell me who has better welds:

AR's welds are flush and clean. To me. iCarbon's stick out like a sore thumb and it also looks like they are trying to hide the welds by "brushing" it! Again, personal opinion.

[N55 Power]

Originally Posted by Bimmer This

Seriously, look again and seriously tell me who has better welds:

AR's welds are flush and clean. To me. iCarbon's stick out like a sore thumb and it also looks like they are trying to hide the welds by "brushing" it! Again, personal opinion.

Does anyone know wether or not both dps use v-butt joints because i think that may have something to do with it. But atleast on the pipes i recieved the welds on icarbon, i found to be more uniform. I still prefer icarbon for that single bend alone. Even though it probobly doesnt make that much of a difference in flow, I prefer that look because it looks much cleaner to ME

[Proper Motion LLC]

That looks polished

[McMuffin]

If you must get AR products, I recommend going through Mike@N54tuning or Alan ************! Those to guys IMO have awesome customer service!!

Congrats on your new found power!

[ar design]

Originally Posted by N55 Power

I really dont know where to start on this one.
It has been such a wacky experience that its just really hard to explain.

Let me just tell you my story from the beginning and you be the judge.

I ordered a AR Design n55 downpipe from AR Design on the 5th of December. The reason why i chose them over Icarbon in the first Place i have no idea. Dealing with AR was a pain and let me tell you right now that Andrew is not the kind of guy who should be running a business. I fell sorry for anyone who has to go through the ordeal of having business with andrew.

Let me show you the kind of hoops i had to jump through just to communicate with AR Design.

I emailed AR Design 3 times and he replied once

I PM'd AR design 2 times and he didn't even reply once

I Posted on his thread 3 times and he didnt address my concerns once

And heres the kicker: I called him a whopping 27 times and he answered me only 3 of those times!

I have to admit he did upgrade me and others to overnight. But listen to this. I took my car apart installing this thing when i notice this very frustrating fact: He had forgot to put in the second o2 bung!! After all this he did not even take the time to check ONCE that the Downpipe was correctly made and even when i call him about that he doesnt admit that my car even needs the second bung and tells me to jury rig it!! Youve got to be kidding me.

I tried everything too return my useless dp from AR design but he would never return any of my calls I sent him after getting the dp. The way i see it his attitude is that once he gets your money and sends you whatever pipe he whips up that its your problem. I was forced to ship the thing back on MY DIME and get a credit card charge-back. Real professional.

I got such a bad taste in my mouth after this that i just called it quits on the mods, however that did not last long

I got the icarbon dp and it is much higher quality for a better price. I installed it today and im really impressed.

Overall the icarbon is better than Ar. Better welds,The tubing is mandrel bent and not cut to bend like Ar.

Fitment was good but needs improvement: 2nd bung should be farther away from the mount by maybe a quarter of an inch and the mounts need better alignment but thats it. The dp sounds amazing and the turbo whistle is almost as loud as a tuned diesel truck.

The thing that most impressed me about icarbon and hpautowerkes is that they followed a very important business rule: Underpromise and overdeliver.

I called hpautowerkes and they said my my pipe would ship out friday or monday but to my surprise it ARRIVED monday! Underpromising and overdelivering unlike AR Design who, as everyone knows said the pipes would ship out in 2-3 weeks from order when in fact they shiped out 3-4 weeks late. So closer to 5-7 weeks to get your pipe.


Bottom Line: IMO AR really isnt a nice place to do business with. His products are overrated.Hes focusing on looking good and not being good. He is too busy getting tape and boxes that have his logo on it. Icarbon and HPautowerkes on the other hand are good and i wish them both well.

Ill probably post up a video of the Icarbon and AA axelback combo that im running as there may be differences than the AR, seeing as people are only posting up videos of the AR dp.

Heres a pic for whatever reason:

Hey,

I am sorry to hear you were not happy with the downpipe. A couple things:

• I remember talking to you ONCE before your install. I never received ANY voice mails from you. I am a one man team in the office, and I am not always able to answer the phone as I am in the shop quite often, and can't even hear it ring. But I try to always answer voice mails, which I don't recall getting any from you.
• I suggested extending the O2 sensor wiring by unclipping it. I did not tell you to jury rig it in any way shape or form.
• I told you if you had ANY issue I would be more than happy to repair or replace the pipe. And never heard back from you since then.
• I did receive your downpipe with the note, and was going to refund it accordingly.
• As to our quality, anyone that has held our products knows the welding and fabrication is second to none.

If you want, I would be more than happy to PM you my cell phone number and discuss. Happy to make things right for you as you might see fit. Just let me know!

[ar design]

Originally Posted by N55 Power

Also i would like to add that on the icarbon the main tubing is a gradual mandral bend. On th AR he uses straight pipe but cuts it at angles to creat a bend, this causes very aggresive curves.not gradual like the icarbon. Look at a picture of the AR an youll see what i mean.

If you look inside ours, it is VERY smooth with a well thought out collector.

[Mikey_Bo0sts]

+1 Very unhappy with Andrews customer care ,even though I like the pipes.