[eleven11]

So I've decided to complete my medical training in Cleveland. I'm excited about the training, but not thrilled about the city (but this is based on the stereotypes you always hear... could be totally off base, who knows). Anyway, a few questions:

As I will only be there a year, I'm going to be renting a house/condo or apartment. Married, no kids. Will be working mostly at Case Western's main campus. I don't mind to drive to work (actually prefer to if that means I like my living area better) I want a suburbia, cookie-cutter sort of place, which I'm assuming is out of the city to a degree. Suggestions and insight are appreciated.

Next, more important issue. So my e90 335 lease is up in June. Originally (when I thought I would still be living in Louisville), I planned on getting an e92 335 and start modding. Cleveland has changed this... or should it? Essentially, I'd like some input on if getting an e92, likely with power mods, on proper winter tires, etc is inadvisable. If not, I'm looking at an X3 etc. Thoughts? Does the X3 suck?

Thanks!

[UdubBadger]

why not get a 335xi e92?

[eleven11]

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

why not get a 335xi e92?

It's on the list. I wasn't sure how truly snow worthy it was.

[Ryan323i]

Tip 1: Get a thicker coat, Cleveland is COLD!!
Tip 2: Winter tires are a must, or just don't get the sport package. The roads suck, watch out for potholes!

I've never driven an X3 but I assume I'd be disappointed after having a 3 series. Don't let the area you live in dictate what you drive. Get what you like!

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by eleven11

It's on the list. I wasn't sure how truly snow worthy it was.

a lot of guys I know have it (I have the slower version).


Trust me it's VERY snow worthy, especially with some winter tires on it. X3 is nice for the space and ground clearance but the 3 should get you where you need to go no problems unless the snow is too high (which has never happened to me yet).

[darkcloud]

Originally Posted by DarkRyan323

Tip 1: Get a thicker coat, Cleveland is COLD!!
Tip 2: Winter tires are a must, or just don't get the sport package. The roads suck, watch out for potholes!

I've never driven an X3 but I assume I'd be disappointed after having a 3 series. Don't let the area you live in dictate what you drive. Get what you like!

1. OK no offense to you but it's not that much colder then Columbus. If you think so you're crazy. Yes get a decent coat(I personally can wear an Arcteryx Easyrider softshell all winter long with not being cold.)

2. Winter tires are not a must. This isn't N. Dakota. Would blizzaks be better? Yes, but I again have never bought winter tires and get around fine on all-seasons. Please feel free to get ZSP or even ZMP package if you'd like. The roads suck no less then the roads in Columbus, again another bozo comment. I've lived in both cities buddy. I just drove through Louisville last week. Our roads are actually no worse then your construction riden shit roads

I've had an X3 loaner twice. I personally thought it drove near identical to my 325i 3er. The car was overall very good for being an SAV. My beef is that I think it's ugly as sin. The good news if you want to go an SAV route is the new X1 and remodeled X3 should both be out by then. The X1 will be about the same size as the current X3 and the new X3 will be about the size of the older X5.

Then again I think you'll be fine with the e92 335i. Just pickup a set of someones 17'' rims with all-seasons on here or a set of something from tire-rack.

If you have any further questions feel free. I can direct you to certain cities by your criteria. I would also assume we're close in age(I'm 26), so if you would ever want to hang out that could be an option too. My wife and I go out with friends fairly often(we're the only couple of all our friends basically so don't be scared thinking you'd be the only single guy)

Good luck with the move. Case will be awesome. They just dumped a ton of money into that area and it's nearly all finished. You know where to find me if you want.

[UdubBadger]

Originally Posted by darkcloud

1. OK no offense to you but it's not that much colder then Columbus. If you think so you're crazy. Yes get a decent coat(I personally can wear an Arcteryx Easyrider softshell all winter long with not being cold.)

2. Winter tires are not a must. This isn't N. Dakota. Would blizzaks be better? Yes, but I again have never bought winter tires and get around fine on all-seasons. Please feel free to get ZSP or even ZMP package if you'd like. The roads suck no less then the roads in Columbus, again another bozo comment. I've lived in both cities buddy. I just drove through Louisville last week. Our roads are actually no worse then your construction riden shit roads

I've had an X3 loaner twice. I personally thought it drove near identical to my 325i 3er. The car was overall very good for being an SAV. My beef is that I think it's ugly as sin. The good news if you want to go an SAV route is the new X1 and remodeled X3 should both be out by then. The X1 will be about the same size as the current X3 and the new X3 will be about the size of the older X5.

Then again I think you'll be fine with the e92 335i. Just pickup a set of someones 17'' rims with all-seasons on here or a set of something from tire-rack.

If you have any further questions feel free. I can direct you to certain cities by your criteria. I would also assume we're close in age(I'm 26), so if you would ever want to hang out that could be an option too. My wife and I go out with friends fairly often(we're the only couple of all our friends basically so don't be scared thinking you'd be the only single guy)

Good luck with the move. Case will be awesome. They just dumped a ton of money into that area and it's nearly all finished. You know where to find me if you want.

you make some good points execpt you forget that being on lake erie will produce a substantial amount more lake effect snow than columbus would ever see.

Temp wise, yeah you guys might be within like 5 degrees each day, but snowfall wise Cleveland is going to get about 2x more than Columbus.

Clevelands last 5 yr totals have been between 50-117 inches... 117 obviously being quite extreme. Columbus averages about 30 inches a year.

I still think being right on a lake in a town with potential to get a winter similar to one in North Dakota (04-05 had 117 inches) you'd be better off just getting some winters just to be safe no matter what car you are driving.

[darkcloud]

You can read the 5 year totals all you want but you don't live in it.

We get the snow sloooowly in small increments. Kinda like it will snow 1-3 inches every other day. Which isn't a lot but after a loong winter does add up and looks bad but it isn't. It also rarely snows during times of day where it interferes with driving/rush hour, it's hard to explain but you'd understand if you live here. Cleveland also has very efficient and hard working plow truck crews. Kinda how Columbus will get 5 inches of snow, shut down and shit a brick. Where Cleveland will get a day where we are dumped on with 10 inches and people are still truckin to work.

Cleveland's snow totals depend highly on which area of the city you live in. If you don't want to deal with lake effect snow then you better not live on the east side. Again another odd thing that hard to understand unless you've lived it your entire life. I grew up the first city west of Cleveland. We would get no snow and 3-5 miles east would get pummeled and the schools would have snow days, it's odd stuff.

I drove my 325i, not xi, with the OEM all seasons and not once got stuck. Never. Winter tires are not exactly necessary, but yeah they would be nice for piece of mind.

[UdubBadger]

oh and I would totally assume that a city like Cleveland would have a great plowing system... just like i said though, I personally would rather be safe than sorry and it sounds like it could be warranted to get some in those kinds of weather conditions.

[Ryan323i]

Originally Posted by darkcloud

1. OK no offense to you but it's not that much colder then Columbus. If you think so you're crazy. Yes get a decent coat(I personally can wear an Arcteryx Easyrider softshell all winter long with not being cold.)

2. Winter tires are not a must. This isn't N. Dakota. Would blizzaks be better? Yes, but I again have never bought winter tires and get around fine on all-seasons. Please feel free to get ZSP or even ZMP package if you'd like. The roads suck no less then the roads in Columbus, again another bozo comment. I've lived in both cities buddy. I just drove through Louisville last week. Our roads are actually no worse then your construction riden shit roads

I've had an X3 loaner twice. I personally thought it drove near identical to my 325i 3er. The car was overall very good for being an SAV. My beef is that I think it's ugly as sin. The good news if you want to go an SAV route is the new X1 and remodeled X3 should both be out by then. The X1 will be about the same size as the current X3 and the new X3 will be about the size of the older X5.

Then again I think you'll be fine with the e92 335i. Just pickup a set of someones 17'' rims with all-seasons on here or a set of something from tire-rack.

If you have any further questions feel free. I can direct you to certain cities by your criteria. I would also assume we're close in age(I'm 26), so if you would ever want to hang out that could be an option too. My wife and I go out with friends fairly often(we're the only couple of all our friends basically so don't be scared thinking you'd be the only single guy)

Good luck with the move. Case will be awesome. They just dumped a ton of money into that area and it's nearly all finished. You know where to find me if you want.

I wasn't comparing Cleveland to Columbus. The OP looks to be from Louisville so Cleveland will probably seem a bit colder to him. As for the roads, I can only compare the ones I drive on in both cities. The roads I drive on daily in Columbus are fine for the most part. Whenever I drive to Cleveland to visit family or friends, I feel like my car takes a beating in certain areas. Winter/all-season tires are "preferred" is what I should have said I guess.

[eleven11]

Hey guys, thanks for all of the great replies. Really good insight that I will take into my considerations.

[TQ_trackman]

eleven,

I live in Cleveland's east side "snow belt" and have been through 2 winters already with my E92 ZSP with no problems. If you put on a set of decent snows like Blizzaks or Winter Sports (which I have) you will be getting better traction then all of the FWD Accord/Camry/minivan drivers on their all seasons. And DarkCloud is correct about the big difference in snow totals depending upon which side of town you live on. West side gets a lot less than the east side, and even on the east side the northeast gets a lot more than the south east. I say get yourself the E92 and enjoy it!

[Ricer X]

why limit your driving pleasure over 3-4 months of snow fall? Even then, it doesn't snow every day of those 3-4 months. I concur with everyone else. I just picked up a set of Blizzaks from a local distributor (WheelSto - the best!) for $580 delivered/mounted and installed.

[Chewy734]

Just saw this thread and thought I'd chime in...

I've lived in Columbus for nearly 20 years, and now Cleveland for ~10 years. The weather in Columbus is usually quite different than Cleveland. In general it's ~5 degrees colder (although sometimes it's warmer or the same compared to Columbus). The wind is significantly higher due to the lake, making it colder than Columbus. There are times when the wind chill is below 0 in Cleveland almost every winter, when I can only remember it happening once or twice in Columbus during the time I was there.

In terms of snow it's hit or miss. Last winter sucked unbelievably. Not only was it super long, but there were a ton of snow storms. I have a 330i with sport suspension and got stuck two days. These are with 17" rims and Blizzak WS60 deep snow tires. Honestly, there's not much you can do if there's a foot of snow on the ground and they haven't cleaned the roads. The road clearance is key, and no matter what car you had those days (FWD, RWD, AWD, etc), you were getting stuck unless you had an SUV.

Other than those extreme days, you should be fine getting either an XI with stock all-season tires, or I with winter tires. I recommend the Blizzak WS60s from TireRack, because hands down those will significantly improve braking and slipping during acceleration. If you ship it from TireRack driectly to the BMW dealer you buy the car from, they'll even install and mount it to you for free when you pick up your car! I would take a RWD car with Blizzaks over any AWD car with all-seasons any day in winter.

Next, it depends on where you live in Cleveland. If you live in the University Circle area (where I lived for probably 6 our of the 10 years now), you should be ok with the XI with all-seasons. If you live south or east or southeast of Cleveland (in the snow belt), most people there have SUVs. Why? Because of the snow... snow tires won't do you any good if the amount of snow is higher than the ground clearance of your car.

Enough about weather though... honestly, there aren't many places in the US that have worse lake-effect snow than Cleveland. I can't think of another place other than the horrors of Buffalo. Yes, Cleveland plows their streets, but it doesn't help if it snows a week straight, 24 hrs a day. Plus the snow plows damage the streets, so when the snow melts and spring arrives all the streets have potholes.

A little about the streets... there are suburbs like Shaker Heights, Solon, Mayfield Heights, Beachwood, etc that have enough money to support the maintenance of streets. But there are other places like the City of Cleveland, and pretty much any area adjacent to it that doesn't have the money. Their solution? 1) Wait until giant sink holes develop before doing anything about it. 2) Put a steel plate on top of the pothole. Honestly, the streets aren't any better (and in some places worse) than Philly.

If you give me some more info about where you plan on living near the Case area I can give you some more thoughts and suggestions...

Sorry about my previous rants, but I've had a rough week dealing with a sinkhole/giant pothole last week and damage my car. So I'm a little more jaded with this city as of late, than usual. Being in the low 50s with heavy winds and constant rain doesn't help either. I wish I could say you would get used to this weather, but 10 years later I'm not... and I've come to the realization that I really will never be.

All those negative things being said, I did want to end in a positive note. The culture, arts, sports and other things that make this city Cleveland sets it apart from all other cities in the state, or even in the US. We have the Rock Hall, several pro sports teams (although I truly miss the Buckeyes, and nothing beats college sports in a college town), some of the best museums in the world, and one of the top three orchestras in the world. I would say the zoo is nice, but it doesn't compare to the Columbus one (one of the best in the world, imo).

But enough of my ramblings... I can't make the decision of a 335 or X3 for you. I have a 330i, and my gf has an X3. They are both very different vehicles. I would trust her X3 more in the winter than my car, but hands down my car for the drivability and fun factor. Oh yeah, and she can haul a lot more stuff too. Unless you need the extra trunk space, or like the feel of an SUV my choice would be the 335xi, or 335i with really good winter tires.

I hope I didn't scare you from my post, because it wasn't my intention. Just like any other city, it has its good parts and bad ones. I thought these tourism videos were rather hilarious:

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[Ricer X]

[QUOTE=Chewy734;6009961]Just saw this thread and thought I'd chime in...

In terms of snow it's hit or miss. Last winter sucked unbelievably. Not only was it super long, but there were a ton of snow storms. I have a 330i with sport suspension and got stuck two days. These are with 17" rims and Blizzak WS60 deep snow tires. Honestly, there's not much you can do if there's a foot of snow on the ground and they haven't cleaned the roads. The road clearance is key, and no matter what car you had those days (FWD, RWD, AWD, etc), you were getting stuck unless you had an SUV.

Other than those extreme days, you should be fine getting either an XI with stock all-season tires, or I with winter tires. I recommend the [URL="Just saw this thread and thought I'd chime in...[/QUOTE]


I think these two paragraphs say it all. Proper tires and ground clearance are key. I'm sure all of us who live in the snow belt think that we have it the worst (outside of Buffalo). Its human nature. The key is how many of those extreme days are there normally? And do you have leeway or an alternate plan on those days or can you just live with "punting" on those days and staying home? I have the luxury of working from home when I want, so for me its an easy choice.

[Darkcyd_Turbo]

Psssshhhh, clearance my hiney...last winter my S4 was pretty freakin' low. Yeah I had coilovers but I was too damn lazy to adjust and pay for a stupid alignment so I tend to "set it and forget it" lol and I had the old old versions of the Blizzak ws60 (revo 1's) and never ever ever got stuck.

If it weren't for my engine being warm there would be a crap ton of snow in the front grill where the S4 badging is.



I have an e92 n54 xi and plan on picking up a set of dedicated winter wheels just because I loved it so much on my S4. And I think the runflats are going to be junk in the winter!!!

[UdubBadger]

noel.

we need to do some winter drifting photos this year

[Darkcyd_Turbo]

Originally Posted by UdubBadger

noel.

we need to do some winter drifting photos this year

Totally down for some all wheel driftin'!

[Darkcyd_Turbo]

Dude, my S was totally covered that day...I had to come back because my wheels got packed with snow and I had a helluva time trying to get the snow out!

[eleven11]

Again, great stuff guys. Thanks alot!

[Krystian_E46]

x3 is like a bigger version of e90 best i can explain it