[M3to335]

This may have already been discussed, so please disregard if thats the case...

Would anyone else out there like to be able to load maps, manipulate values and data log right on the Iphone (just as the PROcede software does)?

Personally its a PITA to lug the battery draining laptop around to track events and so forth. Not to mention your not allowed to have any loose items in the car. The phone tucks away in the glove box or center console so easy.

I'm sure one of you geeks can figure it out

[jpsimon]

Of course it would be amazing, I made a mockup a long time ago and posted it on here. It's not a simple task in any way shape or form though

[TMR]

I completely agree!!!!!!!!

But then... how will the iphone interface with the revII? possibly a bluetooth reviver that plugs into the revII but then... can the iphone use BT for other than phone?

Just do what i did... buy a small cheap thinkpad just for the car.

[jpsimon]

no you can't use bluetooth for this, you'd have to use wifi like the Rev app uses

[jpsimon]

see here for my mockup:
http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...iphone+procede

[OpenFlash]

An iphone app is certainly something that we'd be interested in doing. But with so much on the plate right now, time is at a premium. Once we get done with all the new CANbus goodies, it's something that we can look into. But for now, it's got to go on the back burner

[M3to335]

Maybe some one other than Vishnu can step to the plate

[Vudoo4u2]

it doesnt have to be via wifi or any difficult task like that...why not just a usb-->iphone plug so anyone who has a usb cable in their glove box from your install, can just plug in. less interface bs...just someone who knows the sdk real well to convert procede reader software etc to the portable osx format

[Slidewayz]

My company would be delighted to do it...I just need cash to pay a developer to pound it out.

The right way to do this would be as a JV with Vishnu so we could get the source code for the laptop software as a reference implementation.

The comm. part is trivial...one of the guys on my team is one of the best in the world with that stuff.

Sooo......great idea, but no $$$ to fund it. Hey, sounds like a startup!

[OpenFlash]

Originally Posted by got psi

i'd be willing to take a go at it. im a uber geek when it comes to shit like this

woot!

Hmmm.....Do you have a PROcede?

[Slidewayz]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

Hmmm.....Do you have a PROcede?

Yes.

[remydlc]

Shiv,

You will have to closely work with someone. you might have to release the source code for your procede software, and have someone re-write it to Apple's Objective-C (iphone programming language). Of course it is going to be more difficult than that since the developer will need to build from scratch the I/O because these are going to be handled different by the iphone kernel (Mach).

It will be easier to port it to OSX, then to the iphone. They share a vastly amount of source code, only the GUI code is different. It will be easier to deal with Darwin (OSX) development in a MAC laptop directly, rather than re-write code, load it to the iphone everytime, re-connect the phone, and test. Too much time can be wasted.

Anyway, IMHO, not too much can be allowed if the software is ported to the iphone, like loading maps/flashing the procede, it is not reliable. Imagine someone calls you right on the middle of flashing your piggy? you will be screwed with a bricked you can call procede. Then it is gonna have to be sent back to de-brick it.

Yes, some security questions, even turning off the radio can be implemented from the app, but too much PITA. Datalogging will be the only useful thing you can do with an iphone. Similar options are available with Rev.

[dmurray14]

Hmm. I PM'ed shiv a while back about a WiFi solution I have in mind. Was thinking about the iPhone when I had this in mind too. I can definitely get the Procede to be completely wireless on a wifi network, but one of you guys good in Objective-C would need to do the iPhone interface part. As far as the computer goes, it would be just like you were connected with the USB/serial cable but with no wires...no programming needed there. And it should be no problem getting the iPhone to communicate...just a simple TCP socket assuming there's nothing crazy going on between the reader software and the procede itself (encryption wise).

Dan

[Mark313]

Originally Posted by shiv@vishnu

An iphone app is certainly something that we'd be interested in doing. But with so much on the plate right now, time is at a premium. Once we get done with all the new CANbus goodies, it's something that we can look into. But for now, it's got to go on the back burner

Any news on the meth? Haven't heard about that too much recently.

[dmurray14]

Originally Posted by got psi

iphone dev kit includes an iphone emulator to run on osx thus eliminating the need for code to be written onto the phone for testing purposes. There would be a need for "Airplane mode" command to be implemented in the app to ensure that no calls/data can be transmitted while running the app so you dont get a phone call in the middle of loading a map. I have some great ideas that i believe can be put to a reality if everything permits. I dont know how comfortable Shiv is with releasing the source code for the PROcede. Shiv would need to be involved in 110% of the process for this to work. I understand the constant development of the PROcede takes a vast amount of his time making it difficult for this task to become a reality at this point in time.

Airplane mode would be tough b/c I believe it disables Wifi too, which I think would be the killer part of this. Does the app not get "suspended" when a call comes in and left open in the background? I know generally there are no background apps, but I wasn't sure if it actually closes it when a call comes in. And are we sure that stopping in the middle of a map upload would brick the procede? Uploading firmware, sure, but I doubt you'd want to do this from the iPhone. But I don't see why a map would have to cause trouble if you're essentially just copying a file. I'd think you could just re-transfer it.

Can you do the interface part? I'd be willing to get the ball rolling on the hardware if you think you could give the software a shot. And I don't think Shiv would necessarily have to share the reader source (though it may be helpful), but would definitely need to give specs on the commands to the unit as well as the format of the data coming out. In reality, though, if you can do Obj-C and basic socket connectivity, this shouldn't be hard at all.

Dan

[Slidewayz]

Yeah, porting the app to an i-phone is non-trivial. It needs to be treated like the software development project it is...the kind that needs to be done properly so cars don't blow up and users don't get frustrated. Most importantly, Shiv has worked very hard to earn the community's respect so this would need to be *really* rock solid and usable.

Rock solid and usable is easy, but it ain't cheap.

It's cool, but I don't know if there would be enough money in it to justify the development costs. As also mentioned, there is intellectual property to be protected so that needs to be addressed contractually.

The hot setup would be to do this as a JavaME app versus writing close to the metal so it can then be ported to Android, Blackberry, & Windows Mobile devices w/o a total rewrite.

Still, I'm not sure the economics of this are compelling.

[Vudoo4u2]

I really dont think wifi is needed, as it would make already installed devices have to then go out and get a wireless router to plug in to the procede etc...really not necessary considering the extreme ease of getting a usb cable in the glove box. Why not just make use of an already super cheap and easily available connection?

As far as using the iphone, in theory, most iphone apps work for itouch as well. So that would eliminate the need for airplane mode junk and worrying about getting a call while using the program.

I dont think this program should be for uploading maps etc. Thats too much risk on a tiny less than reliable (relatiev to a laptop) device. I think this program simply needs to be a map switcher/data logger and thats it. When it comes to loading maps etc, I think a proper laptop is a much better idea.

[Slidewayz]

Wireless security is a big deal, too! Just imagine if someone hacked your wireless network and used it to blow up your engine.

Nasty!

I think it would be cool to just have the data logging, but really cool to have tuning capability as well.

[dmurray14]

Originally Posted by Vudoo4u2

I really dont think wifi is needed, as it would make already installed devices have to then go out and get a wireless router to plug in to the procede etc...really not necessary considering the extreme ease of getting a usb cable in the glove box. Why not just make use of an already super cheap and easily available connection?

As far as using the iphone, in theory, most iphone apps work for itouch as well. So that would eliminate the need for airplane mode junk and worrying about getting a call while using the program.

I dont think this program should be for uploading maps etc. Thats too much risk on a tiny less than reliable (relatiev to a laptop) device. I think this program simply needs to be a map switcher/data logger and thats it. When it comes to loading maps etc, I think a proper laptop is a much better idea.

Have you done the research to check to make sure the iPhone/iTouch can act as a USB host (I don't think it can)? And assuming it can, what drivers will you use for the USB to serial adapter? Just because the iPhone uses a USB cable to plug into your computer, and just because the procede can use a serial/usb convertor doesn't mean you just hook them up and they work. Either way there is going to be a hardware aspect to this as well. As long as we're doing the conversion, my thought was to make it wireless since we can. And how would putting a small wireless adapter right next to the procede in the engine compartment be harder than running a cable into the glovebox?

Originally Posted by Railgun

I already did a wifi solution with a NetCom product. Granted, it's not glamourous, but it worked, quite well too. What were you thinking?

I was thinking of integrating a small form factor embedded wifi controller, and putting a small "rubber ducky" antenna antenna somewhere in the engine compartment. Could be done fairly cheaply. I did some research and found a few modules I could probably adapt to work, just need to order some and mess around.

[HighVoltage]

Ive done ethernet + rs232. Its trivial. Throw 802.11 into the mix and things can get tricky with security, signal strength, etc start effecting bandwidth/throughput. Can you do a flash over wifi? Absolutely. Ive built simple tftp based flashes on my products through wifi and havent hosed anything yet, but that also meant creating a failsafe flash process...

The Procede uses a simple RS232 serial interface. The iPhone has half of that equation, a simple TTL serial interface (pins 11 - 13).

http://pinouts.ru/Devices/ipod_pinout.shtml

Now add a RS232 transceiver....

http://www.embedinc.com/products/ser/index.htm
http://www.hvwtech.com/products_view.asp?ProductID=289

Maybe a breakout for the iPhone...

http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/pro...oducts_id=8295

Simple RS232. No wireless issues, no security issues, no flash explosions/meltdowns...

[dmurray14]

Originally Posted by HighVoltage

Ive done ethernet + rs232. Its trivial. Throw 802.11 into the mix and things can get tricky with security, signal strength, etc start effecting bandwidth/throughput. Can you do a flash over wifi? Absolutely. Ive built simple tftp based flashes on my products through wifi and havent hosed anything yet, but that also meant creating a failsafe flash process...

The Procede uses a simple RS232 serial interface. The iPhone has half of that equation, a simple TTL serial interface (pins 11 - 13).

http://pinouts.ru/Devices/ipod_pinout.shtml

Now add a RS232 transceiver....

http://www.embedinc.com/products/ser/index.htm
http://www.hvwtech.com/products_view.asp?ProductID=289

Maybe a breakout for the iPhone...

http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/pro...oducts_id=8295

Simple RS232. No wireless issues, no security issues, no flash explosions/meltdowns...

Well played. Seems like that could work well. I still like the wireless idea because of the convenience and "cool factor" but for stability purposes you're probably right about wired being better.

Another question now - can apps use the serial interface without the phone needing to be jailbroken?

[jpsimon]

Originally Posted by dmurray14

Well played. Seems like that could work well. I still like the wireless idea because of the convenience and "cool factor" but for stability purposes you're probably right about wired being better.

Another question now - can apps use the serial interface without the phone needing to be jailbroken?

I'm pretty sure you can't (but i could be wrong)... thats why wireless would be the only real option (like Rev is doing)