[exk]

Looked on here for some thing on this but did not find anything or if its need with an large intercooler upgrade already as i am new to bwm. Since i live in the hot part of ca 100 plus almost every day in the summer i came up with a water wetter for my wifes super charger air to water heat exchanger that has worked well for many years and plan to make one for the bmw. I already have an large intercooler that came on the car but since it gets hot here i am making one for the bmw. Its simple and cheap to make and drops the intake temp fast. I use about 20' of 1/4" water soaker hose pull tied to the intercooler bars with an 12v 3gpm pump set at 20psi soaking an water / ammonia mix from the wiper tank all controlled with an simple on off toggle to an adj hob switch set at around 18psi.

[Saif2018]

Originally Posted by exk

Looked on here for some thing on this but did not find anything or if its need with an large intercooler upgrade already as i am new to bwm. Since i live in the hot part of ca 100 plus almost every day in the summer i came up with a water wetter for my wifes super charger air to water heat exchanger that has worked well for many years and plan to make one for the bmw. I already have an large intercooler that came on the car but since it gets hot here i am making one for the bmw. Its simple and cheap to make and drops the intake temp fast. I use about 20' of 1/4" water soaker hose pull tied to the intercooler bars with an 12v 3gpm pump set at 20psi soaking an water / ammonia mix from the wiper tank all controlled with an simple on off toggle to an adj hob switch set at around 18psi.

Not really necessary, just get the right FMIC and you should be good. Upto stage 2+ a good 5 inch one should suffice, any higher (hybrids etc) go for a 7+ inch one.

Methanol injection if you absolutely must have extra cooling.

[_N54]

Just get a simple AEM meth kit with charge pipe nozzle cooling and you're good to go. It's like $450 for the kit. Not only will you get cooler intake temps in the summer, but you'll get a decent bump in octane depending on what mix you use.

[mike@x-ph.com]

if you are running stage 1 or stock, get a 5" intercooler

If you are pushing more power I recommend 7"+

MAD, BMS and ARM are probably the best value.

[Torgus]

1) Get a 7.5'' IC 3'' in and out from a reputable vendor. This is basically the largest IC you can fit with a good fin pack.

2) Install a meth kit as said above. Cheap and much better for cooling and you will get increased AKI because of the water/meth

3) IC sprayers are ok but not really worth it. You will be filling up your WW tank a lot to boot.

4) If you have E85 access run E85 vs. pump gas because of AKI index.

[exk]

Thanks every one. My car came with a intercooler that's about 8" tall but have no idea of brand. I run it on an e65 mix as i do not think my fuel system will not support pure e85. It also added 65lb port injectors. As for intake water/mech spray kit i am not that big of fan. On my super charged cars i use extra injectors and spray methanol into the super charger intake that's good for 1.5psi and after the intercooler for cooling, Works very well on long wot 1/4 to 1/2 mile pulls. My drip/ soaker system is mainly good for very hot days and normal driving with short burst of high boost. It uses about 2gallon a minute so it last fairly long and extremely cheap to easy to refill.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by exk

Thanks every one. My car came with a intercooler that's about 8" tall but have no idea of brand. I run it on an e65 mix as i do not think my fuel system will not support pure e85. It also added 65lb port injectors. As for intake water/mech spray kit i am not that big of fan. On my super charged cars i use extra injectors and spray methanol into the super charger intake that's good for 1.5psi and after the intercooler for cooling, Works very well on long wot 1/4 to 1/2 mile pulls. My drip/ soaker system is mainly good for very hot days and normal driving with short burst of high boost. It uses about 2gallon a minute so it last fairly long and extremely cheap to easy to refill.

Please note that what everyone else is measuring is the depth of the intercooler, not the length.

[lookalikehuuh]

Originally Posted by exk

Thanks every one. My car came with a intercooler that's about 8" tall but have no idea of brand. I run it on an e65 mix as i do not think my fuel system will not support pure e85. It also added 65lb port injectors. As for intake water/mech spray kit i am not that big of fan. On my super charged cars i use extra injectors and spray methanol into the super charger intake that's good for 1.5psi and after the intercooler for cooling, Works very well on long wot 1/4 to 1/2 mile pulls. My drip/ soaker system is mainly good for very hot days and normal driving with short burst of high boost. It uses about 2gallon a minute so it last fairly long and extremely cheap to easy to refill.

I would like to see a log of back to back pulls without your water spray and one with; to see what the actual temperature difference really is. Would make sense that you should be able to capture that data for us easily since it sounds like you already have the system installed. Assuming the data proves what you are saying is true then the arguments stop there right?

[Torgus]

From my understanding:

- you spray it with fluid that is well below ambient temperature to increase cooling
- you spray it with fluid that is ambient temperature to prevent heatsoak and hope there is some evaporative cooling going on.

The benefits of preventing heatsoak can easily be remedied with a beefier intercooler core, so using it for that reason is sort of.. meh. Using it with below ambient fluid makes sense, but you'd need to cool down the fluid a lot, and again... it's not lossless so you'd constantly have to refill it and unless you run an AC loop how do you cool it? The only problem with the refrigerant set-up is that you would have drag from the AC compressor all the time. Throw ice in a box in your trunk every time you go for a drive?

If you are going through the hassle of running tubing and pumps to support such a thing why not just install a meth kit and have significantly better gains?

but you do you.

edit: You don't even have to inject meth. You can use straight water, windshield washer fluid, etc. If meth 'scares or bothers you' there are still better gains by injecting into the intact track vs. spraying the IC.

[exk]

Originally Posted by lookalikehuuh

I would like to see a log of back to back pulls without your water spray and one with; to see what the actual temperature difference really is. Would make sense that you should be able to capture that data for us easily since it sounds like you already have the system installed. Assuming the data proves what you are saying is true then the arguments stop there right?

My wifes car is old school built and it does not have any modern data log cap but my bmw will have that for sure. Wife car is an amg 3.2 V6 supercharged maxed out 24.5psi on e85 with 2 extra injectors. It has an fairly radical tune for an daily driver as its not easy to change the tune. Last dyno 3 years ago and 11k miles ago made 561 rwhp @ 5700 and zero issues so something must be working. Like i sad it gets hot here in the summer with many days at 105 + and when dynoed it was only 79 deg and intake temp was 94 deg. My tuner told me it would be best to keep the intake temp under 110 so thats when i came up with this soaker hose setup. I we do not run it hard on 100+ days but some time you just have (Z06 wants to play) and that when we turn on the soaker system

[lookalikehuuh]

Originally Posted by exk

My wifes car is old school built and it does not have any modern data log cap but my bmw will have that for sure. Wife car is an amg 3.2 V6 supercharged maxed out 24.5psi on e85 with 2 extra injectors. It has an fairly radical tune for an daily driver as its not easy to change the tune. Last dyno 3 years ago and 11k miles ago made 561 rwhp @ 5700 and zero issues so something must be working. Like i sad it gets hot here in the summer with many days at 105 + and when dynoed it was only 79 deg and intake temp was 94 deg. My tuner told me it would be best to keep the intake temp under 110 so thats when i came up with this soaker hose setup. I we do not run it hard on 100+ days but some time you just have (Z06 wants to play) and that when we turn on the soaker system

That's cool story and all but again being an Engineer by trade I much prefer to do the data do that talking. So since the Bimmer has the soaker system lets see a back to back log with and without the water spray.

[exk]

Originally Posted by lookalikehuuh

That's cool story and all but again being an Engineer by trade I much prefer to do the data do that talking. So since the Bimmer has the soaker system lets see a back to back log with and without the water spray.

No the bmw does not have an soaker yet. That was why i asked on here as the bmw has an air to air intercooler thats not as efficient IMO as an air to water intercooler on the amg. I recently made up an test soaker system for an air to air intercooler but to date have not had the time to do any testing. You are an engineer so if its over 100 deg and you soak 80 deg or less water on that heat exchanger / intercooler what would happen ???

[Torgus]

Originally Posted by exk

No the bmw does not have an soaker yet. That was why i asked on here as the bmw has an air to air intercooler thats not as efficient IMO as an air to water intercooler on the amg. I recently made up an test soaker system for an air to air intercooler but to date have not had the time to do any testing. You are an engineer so if its over 100 deg and you soak 80 deg or less water on that heat exchanger / intercooler what would happen ???

Where are you getting water that is below ambient temperature?

From my understanding:

- you spray it with fluid that is well below ambient temperature to increase cooling
- you spray it with fluid that is ambient temperature to prevent heatsoak and hope there is some evaporative cooling going on.

If you are going to spray water spray it into your CP. You have to run the same pump, tubing etc. At least CP injection has significant benefits.

[exk]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Please note that what everyone else is measuring is the depth of the intercooler, not the length.

My intercooler core is about 20" L x 8" tall on its face and at the bottom 5" wide but it looks to be only about 2" wide on top (Hard to see or measure) looks like a step. Is that a decant sized a/a intercooler for my bmw ???

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by exk

My intercooler core is about 20" L x 8" tall on its face and at the bottom 5" wide but it looks to be only about 2" wide on top (Hard to see or measure) looks like a step. Is that a decant sized a/a intercooler for my bmw ???

5" intercoolers are suitable for lightly tuned cars. I recommend 7" on stage 2+ applications, but daily drivers can get away with using the 5" as it's still a significant upgrade overstock.

But to answer your question, i would need to know which intercooler you have on the car, your mods and/ or a datalog as not all 5" intercoolers are equal

[Torgus]

Originally Posted by exk

My intercooler core is about 20" L x 8" tall on its face and at the bottom 5" wide but it looks to be only about 2" wide on top (Hard to see or measure) looks like a step. Is that a decant sized a/a intercooler for my bmw ???

You want one sized like this: https://www.vr-speed.com/vrsf-7-5-st...2-e90-e92.html

In my opinion people should just spend the money once and get the largest IC they can fit. It will work from stock twins to making 1k whp. Cry once buy once and you never have to think about it again. Anytime you have to buy the same aftermarket part twice to upgrade, even after used resale factored in, you are significantly upside down on $$$ spent and labor(yours or what you pay a shop).

Once you have the largest IC you can fit spray in your CP. The AIT reductions are great. Add some meth or WW fluid and you gain a nice amount of AKI. This is ESPECIALLY helpful in warm environments.

[exk]

Originally Posted by Torgus

Where are you getting water that is below ambient temperature?

From my understanding:

- you spray it with fluid that is well below ambient temperature to increase cooling
- you spray it with fluid that is ambient temperature to prevent heatsoak and hope there is some evaporative cooling going on.

If you are going to spray water spray it into your CP. You have to run the same pump, tubing etc. At least CP injection has significant benefits.

I have checked the fluid tank temp with an simple cooking therm on an 105 day around 3 o clock and the fluid in the tank was close to 80. That's parked in an insulated garage with the door open all day (102 in there. Never parked it out in the sun all day to test

[exk]

Originally Posted by Torgus

You want one sized like this: https://www.vr-speed.com/vrsf-7-5-st...2-e90-e92.html

Thanks, mine looks very much like the one in your link.

In my opinion people should just spend the money once and get the largest IC they can fit. It will work from stock twins to making 1k whp. Cry once buy once and you never have to think about it again. Anytime you have to buy the same aftermarket part twice to upgrade, even after used resale factored in, you are significantly upside down on $$$ spent and labor(yours or what you pay a shop).

Once you have the largest IC you can fit spray in your CP. The AIT reductions are great. Add some meth or WW fluid and you gain a nice amount of AKI. This is ESPECIALLY helpful in warm environments.

I plan to spray 100% methanol or e85 with plans on injecting into the turbo and a 2nd just before the throttle body. My concern is the long charge pipe and intercooler total volume might have a bigger bang than a burst plate can protect.

[Torgus]

I would not inject meth at the turbo snout. You certainly can. But there is plenty of charge pipe from the ic exit to the tb. If you want multiple nozzles I would do two facing each other or slightly offset at the charge pipe as far away from the tb as possible.

If you want more I would do a 3rd meth bung on the intercooler exit where you can trill and tap you can even do a 4th but at that point why not run port meth if you need that much meth for fueling.

I was under the understanding thronged the meth travels the more it mixes evenly in the air. Perhaps this is wrong?

But no reason to run both port meth and e85. Overkill when one or two in the cp will do just fine on top of e85. If you are running full e85 2 in the cp should be more than enough to cool the AITs and add some aki on top of the e85.

I guess if you do all of this spraying the ic would be icing on top and helpful in high heat environment on along pull like a 1/2 mile event.

Many tracks do not allow you to spray an ic with liquid but if you don't drag race or track who cares.

Please post your final design, be fun to see what it all looks like. Will you use a hobbs switch to trigger the spray? Like at 15 psi for example.

[exk]

Originally Posted by Torgus

I would not inject meth at the turbo snout. You certainly can. But there is plenty of charge pipe from the ic exit to the tb. If you want multiple nozzles I would do two facing each other or slightly offset at the charge pipe as far away from the tb as possible.

If you want more I would do a 3rd meth bung on the intercooler exit where you can trill and tap you can even do a 4th but at that point why not run port meth if you need that much meth for fueling.

I was under the understanding thronged the meth travels the more it mixes evenly in the air. Perhaps this is wrong?

But no reason to run both port meth and e85. Overkill when one or two in the cp will do just fine on top of e85. If you are running full e85 2 in the cp should be more than enough to cool the AITs and add some aki on top of the e85.

I guess if you do all of this spraying the ic would be icing on top and helpful in high heat environment on along pull like a 1/2 mile event.

Many tracks do not allow you to spray an ic with liquid but if you don't drag race or track who cares.

Please post your final design, be fun to see what it all looks like. Will you use a hobbs switch to trigger the spray? Like at 15 psi for example.

Yes a simple on / off toggle to an adj hobb set at 15esh psi to control and 12V pump set at 20 psi. That is how i have it on the amg but i also have been thinking on using an tank that can hold a min of 40 psi and use boost psi with 2 simple inline check valves. 1 check valve to hold the tank pressure in from boost and a 2 to hold fluid flow till a set psi like 15.

Here are a few pics of an test soaker setting on a friends intercooler. Water is only at 14psi. Soaker hose manufactor claimes the hose can safely take 50psi but i use 20psi in the past and 20 foot flowed 2gpm