[HarryTee]

Ok, this is what I always wanted to know but was afraid to ask. I want to enjoy my cars but honestly don’t know how. Can anyone help and give me some ideas?

I believe in safe-driving, but that may have blocked me from experiencing the joy of driving that I’ve heard from other drivers. For an example: I often hear that with a good & strong BMW, you can enjoy driving on twisty country roads or coming out of a corner, etc., but I don’t really know what makes twisty country roads and coming out of corners enjoyable. Do you increase speed in these places to make it enjoyable? If so, would that not increase the risk of losing control and causing accidents? (I must ask, because I tend to slow down on twisty roads : )

[Broncho]

I don’t really find most cars enjoyable to drive quickly being honest.

Try something like an S1 Elise down a country road or an S2000 and that’s where you’ll find enjoyment IMO.

Big saloon cars and the like are far too removed from the environment to be truly exciting to drive, some are very fast and the vast majority of drivers are point and squirt with no real idea about car control or dynamics.

All in my opinion of course.

Do a track day and find the limits in a safer environment.

[robbiep]

Probably one of the ways to really enjoy driving on normal roads is not to have the hugely powerful versions.

My 325d, whilst no slouch, it's an absolute joy to drive. Into a corner on the brakes, getting into the right gear, balancing the car on the throttle as it comes out and straightens up ... all things that you probably struggle to do in a 440i - partly because it's got so much power, partly because it's an automatic gearbox.

One of the most fun cars I've ever driven was a Z3 with the 2.2 litre straight 6. Yes, you could get a far more powerful version. Yes, other cars handled better. But get it right, work it through a string of bends, getting the lines, gearchanges, acceleration, braking points all dead on, and it just put a huge grin on your face - even when you didn't get over 60mph.
You can't do that in a car that does 0-60 in under 5 seconds on a public road without risking losing your licence.

[hybris]

The more twisty the road, the slower you can drive and still have fun - but of course part of the fun is to challenge both yourself and the car (most people aren't good enough a driver to do the latter) - and yes, that means driving fast. And that does naturally come with increased risk to yourself, and possibly others on the road.

The obvious safe(r) alternative is to take your car to track days.

[dizzy619]

Get yourself something like a fiesta st.... All the fun in the world below 60mph

[Tengocity]

What a fascinating question. To be honest, with a powerful car it's getting increasingly more difficult I'd say. The capabilities of them are so high that you're really going silly speeds for it to feel like it's truly engaging.

So I do track days mainly now, and would suggest that Caterhams and other light cars like Lotuses are probably better for on the road now.

[NotGotABimmer23]

Convertible + loud exhaust, should do the trick!

[Techno 9000]

Consider your acceleration coming out of the corner. Squeezing on the power as the apex is passed and vision is increasing. With a rear drive car the weight transfer and slingshot effect can start the good feeling.
You don't need to go, and shouldn't go, faster than the road and conditions allow.
Then, as the next corner approaches, you might choose to slow more than most in order to be able to stop in the distance you have available through the corner, for then you have greater opportunity for acceleration out of that corner again. It can be a virtuous circle for fun, although rubbish for fuel economy (but that's a different subject).

[HighlandPete]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

What a fascinating question. To be honest, with a powerful car it's getting increasingly more difficult I'd say. The capabilities of them are so high that you're really going silly speeds for it to feel like it's truly engaging.

I agree, a very interesting and fascinating topic.

You have the experience of cars like the M4, I appreciate your honesty, that the capabilities of today's cars are so high, make it hard to really engage.

Personally I think we need much smaller cars with less power to really enjoy driving at sensible speeds, without being dangerous.

My mind goes back to cars like the 323i E30, plenty big enough, lovely engine and box, chassis you had to show respect to, consciously work it safely. I have memories of driving across Salisbury Plain many times, each drive putting a big grin on my face.

[Russbmw]

Personally I don't think there's many UK roads that permit any real fun to be had, and even fewer that are safe to try.

I think the most fun I had in one of my own cars was taking my tweaked e39 528 to the Ring. Gave me a chance to really get to know the car - not necessarily find it's limits, but certainly to push on considerably moreso than you would do normally on normal roads, mainly because you're not having to watch out for potholes, police, cameras, other dickheads dawdling along as you come round a bend, that kind of thing.

just have to watch out for GT3's and things coming past you like you're parked up....

I would echo what others have said, in as much as it's not about having a 600bhp monster either, some of teh most fun drives Ive had on normal roads were in my 1994 Mini sprite and also, believe it or not, my RX8.

Top passenger rides at the Ring, incidentally, were an E34 B10, E30 325 and a stripped out E30 M3.

[six]

I agree with smaller and less power and as basic and manual as possible in terms of controls. Skinny tires will help too!

Roads are just too small for the size of mainstream cars we now drive and so busy on top the opportunity to use anything big and powerful while being safe is scarce. I drive some A roads in the Cotswolds where drivers like to give their car some legs. The lanes even on the bigger roads are only just wide enough for the vehicle and so you are passing oncoming cars at a combined speed of 120mph or more separated by one a few feet. The consequences of straying out of your lane and having a head on would be catastrophic.

Thinking about it I actually get more fun out of driving hire cars these days. Recently had a basic Focus over on Madeira, really enjoyed driving on all the different roads, thought the tunnels and up and down the mountain switchbacks...

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

I agree, a very interesting and fascinating topic.

You have the experience of cars like the M4, I appreciate your honesty, that the capabilities of today's cars are so high, make it hard to really engage.

Personally I think we need much smaller cars with less power to really enjoy driving at sensible speeds, without being dangerous.

My mind goes back to cars like the 323i E30, plenty big enough, lovely engine and box, chassis you had to show respect to, consciously work it safely. I have memories of driving across Salisbury Plain many times, each drive putting a big grin on my face.

My M4 is somewhat ridiculous at times on the road... coilovers, aggressive camber and alignment, Cup2 tyres, on top of an already capable package. To even get close to it's optimum operating window is risking jail,never mind losing my license.

Partly why I've gone for the 340i. In many situations I expect it'll be more fun on the road.

Thankfully, I'm at the track once a month or so these days, so the M4 isn't wasted!

[Russbmw]

A friend of mine said the same thing a few years back actually. He's a car trader, so was always in something fancy, and he said that whilst the e90 M3 was a beast at the time, as a daily car that ticked all boxes including having fun, he'd take a 335i all day long. The m3 he said he'd just never get near to...well, as you say, the optimum operating window.

I still want an M something though, that said!

[Russbmw]

Originally Posted by six

Thinking about it I actually get more fun out of driving hire cars these days. Recently had a basic Focus over on Madeira, really enjoyed driving on all the different roads, thought the tunnels and up and down the mountain switchbacks...

That's because all hire cars are inherently the racing versions

[six]

Originally Posted by Russbmw

That's because all hire cars are inherently the racing versions

It was particularly quick in reverse too

[Witney]

Most fun car I had was a mark 1 1.8 MX-5, manual. Great gearbox and handling.

[dopper99]

I agree with the above, less is more when it comes to fun on the road at normal speeds. A lighter, smaller, short wheel based car is the key IMO and it doesn't need 400bhp+.

We need to accept the likes of 3/4 series these days is not a "fun" car in the way that a hot hatch is for example. What you gain on luxury and practicality you lose out on the overall fun factor as they bigger/longer and more weight laden.

BMW make masterpiece 6 cylinder engines but their downside is a slightly heavier front end and that slight lack of turn-in that denies the car to put a smile on your face.

OK 2 litre engines sound no-where near as good but we've all applauded the sweeter handling of those 320 courtesy cars we've had, even though they are dog slow in comparison performance-wise.

Even the M3 CP I had felt a heavy(ish) car. It wasnt "M2 light", put it that way and as Tengo said, you need to be doing silly speeds to get the best from it and properly enjoy it and make it feel fun. And I agree that these cars are really best left as track weapons.

[Malone]

Don’t get me wrong - I love the sheer noise and power of our 340i, but I find I have more driving fun in my work VW Transporter van. A nice clear run through the twisties along the A272 from Billingshurst to Petworth, or the A285 or A286 over the South Downs at 50/60 mph feels far more enjoyable.
Annoyingly, this fun is usually ruined by some old fart in a Honda Jazz with their foot in one position on the throttle, doing 40 on a flat, 20 uphill and 60 downhill and me sitting wishing I was in the 340i so I could get past them!!

[Tengocity]

I think this is also why I'd be inclined to say the 330e is the sweet spot of the G20 range now. If we accept that a modern car is more about being a consumer good, rather than about outright driving pleasure, then for the modern world of congested roads, limited space to use big performance, growing concern about carbon dioxide and local pollution emissions, it makes so much sense. It's a perfectly good car to drive, and better as a standard car than the F30 was, a whole suite of passive and active safety features that also take the stress out of driving on congested roads, and a drive train that allowed me to run on electric in London all day yesterday, and average 70mpg getting there and back from Oxford.
There is absolutely nothing about the M4 that would have been better, unless I was going there to pose!

[nickcuprar]

As James May said.

It's not how much power you have it it's how much you can use!

Most fun I've had in a car was my old mans Abarth 595C only 180bhp but you could use it everywhere as the thing just grips!! It was loud and ridiculous, banged and crackled and is still the only car that's made me laugh out loud whilst driving......

Experience a Classic mini if you haven't already? I'm trying to do more classic car events, as the sound, and smell of fumes is what makes me enjoy driving!

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by nickcuprar

As James May said.

It's not how much power you have it it's how much you can use!

Most fun I've had in a car was my old mans Abarth 595C only 180bhp but you could use it everywhere as the thing just grips!! It was loud and ridiculous, banged and crackled and is still the only car that's made me laugh out loud whilst driving......

Experience a Classic mini if you haven't already? I'm trying to do more classic car events, as the sound, and smell of fumes is what makes me enjoy driving!

Same here. Been a regular at Goodwood FoS for years and have now signed up as a fellow so I can go to the Members meeting. The video footage of the old cars moving around, with real racing and proper engine noise looks amazing.

[dazzapb]

I live in the London suburbs near twick rugby ground and limited fun to be had. 20 zones all over the shop now traffic light to traffic light and speed bumps with potholes. The poor x3m, cycling is more fun.