BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
M2 Technical Topics > S55 Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust / Bolt-ons / Tuning > Flash ECU only for OPF (Warranty?)

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-08-2019, 04:09 PM   #1
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Flash ECU only for OPF (Warranty?)

Assuming I decide to flash the ECU of my M2C only for OPF Bypass, where would that leave me with warranty?

I'd keep all the car engine settings to stock, no modification whatsoever, except for the OPF sensor. I'd also use the BM3 tune feature to flash back to stock without it showing on the anti-tamper meter thing.

Assuming I spin my crank hub, fack my engine up and am in need of a new one. Would I have any issues?

From what I've read BMW can identify tunes through vehicle behaviours (speed, boost etc.) but in my case everything would be stock so nothing out of the ordinary.

I've also read that because of OPF, EU M2C was tweaked to be a bit more powerful and am wondering how the removal of it could negatively affect vehicle behaviour.

Thoughts?
Appreciate 0
      03-08-2019, 04:25 PM   #2
akkando
Major General
akkando's Avatar
5860
Rep
6,631
Posts

Drives: 17 M2 DCT LBB,11 e90 M3 ZCP IB
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Bay Area

iTrader: (1)

It leaves you without a warranty, if they find out, and if they try hard enough, they will find out.

BUT, they could decide to handle it under warranty anyway because SCH is a known issue and they might want to keep you as a customer, or not.
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 09:25 AM   #3
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by akkando View Post
It leaves you without a warranty, if they find out, and if they try hard enough, they will find out.

BUT, they could decide to handle it under warranty anyway because SCH is a known issue and they might want to keep you as a customer, or not.
How would they find out though if all settings are kept stock with the exception of the OPF?

Unless OPF filter removal drastically changes the car's performance in a way where the values indicate a modification, there should be no real indication of the ecu flash. Flash counter should also be frozen and shouldn't highlight any modification either way.

Surely, they would denie warranty for anything related to the exhaust but if car is left stock and SCH occurs, can they really void warranty for the entire engine?
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 09:41 AM   #4
///M Houbi
Major
///M Houbi's Avatar
Switzerland
1653
Rep
1,237
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Forget about your warranty! 100%!
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 11:22 AM   #5
doughboy
Major General
doughboy's Avatar
1543
Rep
8,972
Posts

Drives: 2018 M2 Comp 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK

iTrader: (2)

OPF bypass is tampering with the cars emission system, so is illegal also (technically).

For sure they would blame a blown engine on a REMAP. No warranty on engine failure.

Even if they don't see the map they would know something was modified for it to run without OPF.

You have to "pay to play" as they say. You mod you pay!
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 12:43 PM   #6
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by doughboy View Post
OPF bypass is tampering with the cars emission system, so is illegal also (technically).

For sure they would blame a blown engine on a REMAP. No warranty on engine failure.

Even if they don't see the map they would know something was modified for it to run without OPF.

You have to "pay to play" as they say. You mod you pay!
But it wouldn't be a 'remap', in the sense that the car settings would stay stock and unaltered.

OPF removal is illegal, yeah but it's not really a performance mod or at least it's not intended as such

Thing is, you really just need to change the mid-pipe (e.g. AA's one) to completely change and improve the exhaust sound on the car but that involves getting rid of the OPF.
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 12:56 PM   #7
///M Houbi
Major
///M Houbi's Avatar
Switzerland
1653
Rep
1,237
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
You seem not to understand? :-)

You change a single bit in any ecu's software and the GAME IS OVER no matter what. End of the story.
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 01:15 PM   #8
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Houbi View Post
You seem not to understand? :-)

You change a single bit in any ecu's software and the GAME IS OVER no matter what. End of the story.
No it seems you don't understand what I'm saying.

With current flash software, you're able to revert ECU to stock settings while freezing the anti-tamper meter.

With the car not being tuned, there would be no obvious signs of tuning such as increased boost, speed over the v-max, fuel consumption, essentially all the parameters which would indicate the car is tuned would not be present in the data in the other ecu's

When you bring you car for servicing you'd revert flash tune (only opf sensor bypass in the tune) to stock settings and probably also re-install stock car tubing to avoid suspicion.

By Flash Tune I simply mean, access to ECU not a modification of the engine parameters. OPF bypass is the only end-goal.
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 02:12 PM   #9
///M Houbi
Major
///M Houbi's Avatar
Switzerland
1653
Rep
1,237
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Switzerland

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Ok. You convinced me...

You can flash back the original dme and there is no chance BMW will caught you doing so...

Do it this way and it will take em less than 30 sec and you or better your warranty are nailed

You need to be WAY MORE creative than this if you want to fool BMW or any other manufacturer. Believe me, i know a bit or two about how this stuff works and you clearly don't so better take my advice
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 05:59 PM   #10
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Houbi View Post
Ok. You convinced me...

You can flash back the original dme and there is no chance BMW will caught you doing so...

Do it this way and it will take em less than 30 sec and you or better your warranty are nailed

You need to be WAY MORE creative than this if you want to fool BMW or any other manufacturer. Believe me, i know a bit or two about how this stuff works and you clearly don't so better take my advice
Catch*

If you know a bit or two more enlighten me please

Rather this be a constructive discussion rather than you just saying "nein das ist absolut nicht möglich"
Appreciate 0
      03-09-2019, 10:18 PM   #11
MR RIZK
Major
MR RIZK's Avatar
Australia
757
Rep
1,336
Posts

Drives: AW M2C
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Australia

iTrader: (0)

Flash ECU only for OPF (Warranty?)

FiatMultiplaAkrapovic I think they understand what you are saying. At the end of the day you are altering the dme parameters from the original and it is your word against theirs if they choose to dig deeper and find out that it has been altered even though the parameter you are altering wouldn't be likely contributing to a hub issue.

No one on this forum will give you a yes or no answer and quite frankly not qualified to do so. It's just speculation or educated information based on previous history and/or professional experience. Different BMW dealers and their associated assessors all have different opinions so it is luck of the draw on how they look after you warranty wise. Keep in mind what ever is now can change in the future. No one can predict the future on BMW evolving detection methods.

If you are concerned then you leave as is or engage a lawyer for further validation, or take a semi proven way like locking the dme, cloning the dme, wait till there is a OPF simulator released if there is such a thing or move to the US.

You are asking for warranty advice from non BMW employees. Maybe you should ask BMW and see what they say j/k

Good luck in your endeavour for a better sounding exhaust as that is what I'm assuming you are trying to achieve.

PS: ///M Houbi if you know something about detection methods would be great if you shared this info.
__________________
Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
Appreciate 2
Dav3946.50
///M Houbi1653.00
      03-09-2019, 10:46 PM   #12
Dav3
Major
Dav3's Avatar
947
Rep
1,027
Posts

Drives: G87 M2/E89 35is/F21 M140i/GT4
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Europe

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MR RIZK View Post
FiatMultiplaAkrapovic I think they understand what you are saying. At the end of the day you are altering the dme parameters from the original and it is your word against theirs if they choose to dig deeper and find out that it has been altered even though the parameter you are altering wouldn't be likely contributing to a hub issue.

No one on this forum will give you a yes or no answer and quite frankly not qualified to do so. It's just speculation or educated information based on previous history and/or professional experience. Different BMW dealers and their associated assessors all have different opinions so it is luck of the draw on how they look after you warranty wise. Keep in mind what ever is now can change in the future. No one can predict the future on BMW evolving detection methods.

If you are concerned then you leave as is or engage a lawyer for further validation, or take a semi proven way like locking the dme, cloning the dme, wait till there is a OPF simulator released if there is such a thing or move to the US.

You are asking for warranty advice from non BMW employees. Maybe you should ask BMW and see what they say j/k

Good luck in your endeavour for a better sounding exhaust as that is what I'm assuming you are trying to achieve.

PS: ///M Houbi if you know something about detection methods would be great if you shared this info.
Fair points, completely agree with them.

I'm not expecting any clear yes/no answers, as there's too many variables involved. However, I'm just throwing a potential hypothesis with the hope that other members, with much more technical knowledge and experience, give some insight on the matter. Just saying, 'No, not possible, forget it' is not really constructive because as you said, it's not really a black and white thing.

At the end of the day, OPF filters are here to stay in the EU and pose as a serious limitation for present and future car owners. These threads last for decades and attract thousands of registered and non-registered users, I think there's nothing wrong about properly discussing any OPF solution at this stage as it will lay ground for future discussions.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2019, 06:44 AM   #13
Karmic Man
Lieutenant Colonel
Karmic Man's Avatar
Australia
1996
Rep
1,759
Posts

Drives: M2C
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: World

iTrader: (0)

Why put yourself in such a position in the first place? When you are not even gaining much performance...

Even if BMW warrants it at the end it will take up a lot of your sweat and time to convince them to honour the warranty when the DME was technically altered! You might even have to bring the case to court and let a Judge to decide so I really don't think it's worth the hassle.
Appreciate 0
      03-10-2019, 12:21 PM   #14
doughboy
Major General
doughboy's Avatar
1543
Rep
8,972
Posts

Drives: 2018 M2 Comp 6MT
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: UK

iTrader: (2)

Agood way to avoid tunes being spotted at service is not to take your car to BMW for servicing then it can just stay tuned as an indy won't be bothered.

Only go to BMW for warranty work, then you will need to put OPF back on and relock dme, hopefully it won't ever need to go to BMW in that case.

My M2C is not going near BMW again after the running in service.

Last edited by doughboy; 03-10-2019 at 12:28 PM..
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:42 PM.




m2
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST