[mbhammer]

This forum is jam packed with detailed discussions of myriad problems owners are facing. As some have said, feels at times like we are beta testers. On balance**, seems like most of us are okay with that... on expectation/assumption there's someone or some team inside of BMW Product Development scouring this forum and noting the issues... with plans to address them in a major software/firmware release and/or service campaign(s).

Questions become:

Can anyone say, with 100% certainty, that BMW is actually out here working with our content?

If yes, then do we need to start a fresh list of all the issues we've come across? (One was started a while ago, but I think it's become stale.)


** Want to acknowledge that some of you have had horrific experiences and are likely not okay with the beta program. Your examples are monumentally disheartening, and I hope that ultimately each of you is made whole by BMW and/or your dealer. (I've had my own finance manager issues, but that's another story.)

[AndroidRobot]

They don't officially read this forum, so no they're not listening. Also the people on here only represent a very small fraction of total owners so what you're saying is based on a skewed sample.

[sygazelle]

G05 has issues and BMW should address them. For those owners who have major issues, i can’t imaging how frustrating it must be.

That said, many owner are experiencing no problems of very few problems. I’ve been on this forum learning for 3 months or so. My wife and I pick up her G05 in 10 days in Spartanburg. The issues I’ve read about on this forum don’t deter me at all. The positive feedback easily offsets the issues. I’m confident that most of the issues will be resolved. In the meantime, my wife will be driving an amazing car. Granted, my opinion may change once we have the car and experience these issues for ourselves.

[gofast182]

Officially, probably not. Unofficially, I'd bet they do. The real "chain of command" here is to go through your dealer's service dept. after which the factory collects data from repairs and PUMA cases. It seems evident that BMW is working the issues as people's software versions slowly creep up. The forum is for commiserating, making sure solutions are quickly communicated among the owner base, and occasionally posting something good.

[Mark609]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

They don't officially read this forum, so no they're not listening. Also the people on here only represent a very small fraction of total owners so what you're saying is based on a skewed sample.

How do you know "they" are not listening? I've C/P links of disaster from this forum to my sales manager and sales rep a few times.

I just got off the phone with my sales rep who said their Genius will call me soon. One of my issues was about the wrinkled back seats. Salesman said all the X5's come that way by design.

Now I'm really torn because the terms have changed on the USAA rebate (from $500 to $250 now) and the impact the corporate sales programs have on the BMW CCA $1,000 rebate. I got off the phone with a CCA program administrator this morn and she said the numbers all depend on when the car was retailed, or sold. Brought to my manager's attention and the bottom line is - my sales manager is gonna sell us the car at what we agreed upon....said he'll eat the loss.

Anyhoo, someone with connections to the corporate office needs to get their attention. Remains to be seen though, does BMW corporate give a damn what their customers want? I'm asking because this is my first time doing biz with BMW. Local dealership has been great! Very caring.... service and customer oriented.

[AndroidRobot]

Originally Posted by Mark609

How do you know "they" are not listening? I've C/P links of disaster from this forum to my sales manager and sales rep a few times.

I just got off the phone with my sales rep who said their Genius will call me soon. One of my issues was about the wrinkled back seats. Salesman said all the X5's come that way by design.

Now I'm really torn because the terms have changed on the USAA rebate (from $500 to $250 now) and the impact the corporate sales programs have on the BMW CCA $1,000 rebate. I got off the phone with a CCA program administrator this morn and she said the numbers all depend on when the car was retailed, or sold. Brought to my manager's attention and the bottom line is - my sales manager is gonna sell us the car at what we agreed upon....said he'll eat the loss.

Anyhoo, someone with connections to the corporate office needs to get their attention. Remains to be seen though, does BMW corporate give a damn what their customers want? I'm asking because this is my first time doing biz with BMW. Local dealership has been great! Very caring.... service and customer oriented.

BMW NA has no official presence on here as mentioned. Based on this they will not officially give a response. It's possible BMW NA does look at this and will do something. Dealerships are completely different and 3rd party

[Mark609]

Originally Posted by AndroidRobot

BMW NA has no official presence on here as mentioned.

I understand and that is their choice.

[wrickem]

Other than a bad KAFAS camera throwing warnings until it got fixed yesterday, I have had zero problem with my G05 (I hope I didn't just jinx myself)

Any "problems" (frustrations) that I did have initially I realized was user error on my part because this one is so different than any car I've had previously.

I also think part of my good experience is due to my CA setting up my car correctly from the beginning, then spending time with me on pick up to set up basic functions and profiles and really explain things.I was my CA's first GO5 delivery and prior to pick up, he spent extra time learning things himself. At delivery, this one was already added to my existing Connected Drive account and it all worked perfectly. My apps all work (Park Now is awesome and I use it seamlessly every day).

I sm still not sure about these "unicorn" cornering lights though

[X5_CC]

I would bet money (and certainly hope) that BMW employees read through posts. It's a way to very quickly identify trends (e.g. twitchy steering) instead of having to wait for things to make it through dealer service centers. I think it would be a lost opportunity for them not to, but of course not officially respond or post (that would open a can of worms).

I know if I personally were an engineer on the development team of a consumer product, just sheer curiosity would lead me to read forums, whether in a work capacity or even outside of work. BMW makes exciting products and I would imagine many engineers who work for BMW have personal interest in their products. But how feedback read on forums makes it into official product improvement processes would be interesting to understand.

[BMPHIL]

Land rover forums have section where customer services take up owners issues and get them answers, BMW could learn from that.

[Mark609]

I just sent an email with links to the U.S.A. corporate office.

[mbhammer]

Originally Posted by X5_CC

I would bet money (and certainly hope) that BMW employees read through posts. It's a way to very quickly identify trends (e.g. twitchy steering) instead of having to wait for things to make it through dealer service centers. I think it would be a lost opportunity for them not to, but of course not officially respond or post (that would open a can of worms).

I know if I personally were an engineer on the development team of a consumer product, just sheer curiosity would lead me to read forums, whether in a work capacity or even outside of work. BMW makes exciting products and I would imagine many engineers who work for BMW have personal interest in their products. But how feedback read on forums makes it into official product improvement processes would be interesting to understand.

You and I are completely in sync. You'd hope -- given that "social media listening" is a customer service/support best practice -- that someone from BMW, even in Product Marketing, would be out here anonymously trolling these threads. There is a treasure trove of valuable content for engineers to dig into.

Even if an issue was later discovered to be user error, a User Interaction engineer could take that feedback and explore if there's not a way to minimize the risk of others experiencing that error.

Designers could take feedback that not everyone "gets" what they were trying to do with the wrinkly back seats. Some people like me like them and understand why they did it, others maybe not so much.

But in cases like what appear to be bonafide problems affecting many owners (at least those on here) like with the autonomous systems, iDrive and Connected-related, cornering lights... they have great user feedback they can use to fix these kinds of things.

True, we are a small fraction of total ownership. But... we are also for the most part "enthusiasts" whose attention to detail and ability to report issues with helpful specificity is greater than the general public.

Would not expect responses online here from BMW. Indeed, that would open a huge can of worms. But hopefully BMW... you are listening.

[Tlon]

FWIW, I received an invitation to speak with someone about the G05 from the email ShareYourThoughts@bmwusa.com. They made an appointment for a call and we spoke for 30-45 minutes. I pretty much read to her what I posted in my initial impressions post of a month ago. She listened to all my feedback, including some really small things that bother me, and when repeating it back seemed engaged in some items specifically. For example, I described the annoyance of comfort access walk away being so sensitive as to lock and unlock repeatedly if you're walking around the car in a garage.

She was well aware of a lot of the complaints being passed around on the board. For example, about AS/S (it's an EPA thing, as others have mentioned, over which they have no control unless they get rid of it completely, which I'm sure they will not be doing), ApplePay (it's an Apple issue that they are working on, but BMW has not role in fixing this), and some of the iDrive issues.

Not sure if I was randomly chosen or if it's something they are doing widely, but I appreciated the opportunity to communicate the good, bad, and ugly (lots of good, a little bad, and one really ugly thing that is ruining the experience for me) about the vehicle.

[beermato]

I would not put FCA out as example of premier customer service, but they do have reps that browse forums - and they do respond and provide proactive assistance. It really surprised me.

[2019x5User]

Originally Posted by Tlon

FWIW, I received an invitation to speak with someone about the G05 from the email ShareYourThoughts@bmwusa.com. They made an appointment for a call and we spoke for 30-45 minutes. I pretty much read to her what I posted in my initial impressions post of a month ago. She listened to all my feedback, including some really small things that bother me, and when repeating it back seemed engaged in some items specifically. For example, I described the annoyance of comfort access walk away being so sensitive as to lock and unlock repeatedly if you're walking around the car in a garage.

She was well aware of a lot of the complaints being passed around on the board. For example, about AS/S (it's an EPA thing, as others have mentioned, over which they have no control unless they get rid of it completely, which I'm sure they will not be doing), ApplePay (it's an Apple issue that they are working on, but BMW has not role in fixing this), and some of the iDrive issues.

Not sure if I was randomly chosen or if it's something they are doing widely, but I appreciated the opportunity to communicate the good, bad, and ugly (lots of good, a little bad, and one really ugly thing that is ruining the experience for me) about the vehicle.

Good to know

[BobsM3Coupe]

Originally Posted by BMPHIL

Land rover forums have section where customer services take up owners issues and get them answers, BMW could learn from that.

Jeep customer relation employees also reply and help out forum members when need be.
BMW would be wise to learn to do the same.

[mbhammer]

Originally Posted by BobsM3Coupe

Jeep customer relation employees also reply and help out forum members when need be.
BMW would be wise to learn to do the same.

AMG Product Managers are active members of forums in the AMG Private Lounge (hosted by MB, restricted to AMG owners). Personal experience is that they are extremely helpful. FWIW.

[jammit]

BMW does not officially listen to or respond to customer complaints made directly to them.
This is company policy.
All complaints must be made through the dealers.
BMW is concerned that if they began responding to direct complaints, it would not scale and would also bypass the dealerships. In addition, it would likely increase the volume of complaints and the costs of directly dealing with customers.

In the 25+ years I have owned BMW's they have never once responded in a satisfactory way to my direct customer complaints.
Unless a large volume of customers vote with their feet - this is unlikely to change.

[drexplode]

I'm a long time bmw customer and love the brand; call me a homer. My experience with their level of customer service and care to address real problems is far beyond any other large corporation that I've experienced. Continue to drive issues to resolution in a professional way and they will support you; work with your dealer and if necessary bmwna. They do care and will help you.

[jammit]

Originally Posted by drexplode

I'm a long time bmw customer and love the brand; call me a homer. My experience with their level of customer service and care to address real problems is far beyond any other large corporation that I've experienced. Continue to drive issues to resolution in a professional way and they will support you; work with your dealer and if necessary bmwna. They do care and will help you.

BMW only responds if you can get a dealer to escalate. Don't waste your time going direct. This is why BMW does not respond to or communicate about issues raised via this forum....

BMW has not evolved their customer service model for the social media era. Other car companies have. This will eventually catchup with them when a big issue forces them - but so far they've managed to avoid.

[mnewnam]

Originally Posted by jammit

BMW only responds if you can get a dealer to escalate. Don't waste your time going direct. This is why BMW does not respond to or communicate about issues raised via this forum....

BMW has not evolved their customer service model for the social media era. Other car companies have. This will eventually catchup with them when a big issue forces them - but so far they've managed to avoid.

In my experience BMW actually has a great social media team, but on Twitter. When we broke down a week after getting our X5, my wife tweeted @BMWUSA about it being BS a brand new car left us stranded with two small children. Within minutes she was asked for contact info via DM and my phone rang in less than an hour with a corporate rep profusely apologizing and said all the right things. She did end up making everything right in the end.

[mnx5er]

I've owned over 20 new BMWs and can say without a doubt they don't care. When I have engaged either the genius folks or BMW customer service, they really don't do much. I've had the genius folks admit to problems and say that is just how it is.

My last attempt was a letter to the BMW NA President. In many high-end companies that will get a response for one of their assistants. Crickets from BMW.

The only way to deal with BMW is via the dealer. The rub with that is sales and service rarely get along and are run as separate businesses. So you have to really become friendly with the service manager to get BMW involved.

Ironically as others have noted, other car companies have figured out that customer service matters and forums are a place where people research cars.

Don't get me wrong, I have loved the BMW products but for the first time find myself really looking at other brands. My local dealerships sell a ton of cars and the experience isn't what is used to be. The electronics are getting less reliable (still have iDrive gremlins in by 2018 F15).

I would love to own a G05, just don't have it in me to fight with BMW about iDrive issues anymore. But --I would never tell anyone not to buy a BMW and hope everyone here loves there G05s. This forum is awesome and who knows, maybe some day I'll change my mind.