[IS+1]

For those who are considering 18" square set-ups for winter, I am posting the following dimensions of some sizes/brands of tires I researched on Tire Rack, and how they compare to the stock 19" tire sizes:

19" stock tires:

Front: 245/35/19 Michelin PSS - 25.8" diameter, 807 revs/mile
Rear: 265/35/19 Michelin PSS - 26.3" diameter, 790 revs/mile

18" square set-up for winter:

Bridgestone Blizzak 245/40/18 - 26" diameter, 801 revs/mile, fits 8.0"-9.5" rim (diameter in between stock fronts and stock rears)

Michelin X-Ice 235/45/18 - 26.3" diameter, 790 revs/mile, fits 7.5"-9.0" rim (matches stock rear diameter exactly)

Michelin X-Ice 245/45/18 - 26.6" diameter, 780 revs/mile, fits 7.5"-9.0" rim (a bit bigger than stock rears, much bigger than stock fronts)

Michelin X-Ice 245/40/18 - 25.7" diameter, 809 revs/mile, fits 8.0"-9.5" rim (smaller than stock fronts and much smaller than stock rears)

I did not include 255 treadwidth tires, or winter performance tires, because I am looking for a narrower treadwidth winter tire that can handle the deep snow we get up here.

Obviously this is a short list, but I figured I'd share it with you guys in case you find it useful.

[andrettifan]

Originally Posted by IS+1

For those who are considering 18" square set-ups for winter, I am posting the following dimensions of some sizes/brands of tires I researched on Tire Rack, and how they compare to the stock 19" tire sizes:

19" stock tires:

Front: 245/35/19 Michelin PSS - 25.8" diameter, 807 revs/mile
Rear: 265/35/19 Michelin PSS - 26.3" diameter, 790 revs/mile

18" square set-up for winter:

Bridgestone Blizzak 245/40/18 - 26" diameter, 801 revs/mile, fits 8.0"-9.5" rim (diameter in between stock fronts and stock rears)

Michelin X-Ice 235/45/18 - 26.3" diameter, 790 revs/mile, fits 7.5"-9.0" rim (matches stock rear diameter exactly)

Michelin X-Ice 245/45/18 - 26.6" diameter, 780 revs/mile, fits 7.5"-9.0" rim (a bit bigger than stock rears, much bigger than stock fronts)

Michelin X-Ice 245/40/18 - 25.7" diameter, 809 revs/mile, fits 8.0"-9.5" rim (smaller than stock fronts and much smaller than stock rears)

I did not include 255 treadwidth tires, or winter performance tires, because I am looking for a narrower treadwidth winter tire that can handle the deep snow we get up here.

Obviously this is a short list, but I figured I'd share it with you guys in case you find it useful.

So, I emailed Keith at Tire Rack and the only 18 inch winter tire they are recommending for the M2 is the X-Ice 245 / 40 / 18 size. In what way are they going to be "much smaller than stock rears"??? That is a concern.

[IS+1]

Originally Posted by andrettifan

So, I emailed Keith at Tire Rack and the only 18 inch winter tire they are recommending for the M2 is the X-Ice 245 / 40 / 18 size. In what way are they going to be "much smaller than stock rears"??? That is a concern.

Based on Tire Rack's own data, the overall diameter of the stock rear PSSs is 26.3", whereas the overall diameter of the X-Ice 245/40/18 is 25.7". "Much" smaller is of course relative to the other differences I have listed. So with the X-Ice 245/40/18 your speedometer may over-read by a few clicks, but no big deal. I'm curious as to why he did not recommend the Blizzaks in the same size, since they have an overall diameter even closer to the stock rear PSSs. I'm sure the X-Ice will be fine, but I don't see why some of the others I've listed (esp. the Blizzaks in the same size) would not be recommended by Keith.

The only explanation I can think of is concern that the fronts will run into clearance issues since the stock front tires are slightly smaller than the stock rears, so the Blizzaks may be too big for the front...

Maybe Keith can weigh in?

[Aronis]

I have used the Dunlop SP Winter Sport tires for many years. The dimensions are the same as the Michelin X-Ice, but the Dunlop's are speed rated for 149 mph vs 130 for the Michelin's. So on the dry days in winter you're limited to only 130 mph. LOL...

JK...

I am just curious why TR pushes the Michelins?

Mike

[IS+1]

Originally Posted by Aronis

I have used the Dunlop SP Winter Sport tires for many years. The dimensions are the same as the Michelin X-Ice, but the Dunlop's are speed rated for 149 mph vs 130 for the Michelin's. So on the dry days in winter you're limited to only 130 mph. LOL...

JK...

I am just curious why TR pushes the Michelins?

Mike

I've driven through Binghamton on my way down to DC... your winters are way kinder than ours Here, SP Winter Sports wouldn't cut it... sadly, we need hard core winter tires, such as X-Ice, Blizzaks or Nokians, especially with RWD.

[Aronis]

Originally Posted by IS+1

I've driven through Binghamton on my way down to DC... your winters are way kinder than ours Here, SP Winter Sports wouldn't cut it... sadly, we need hard core winter tires, such as X-Ice, Blizzaks or Nokians, especially with RWD.

WRONG!

I lived in Malone, NY for 7 years, and drove my A6 sport and then RS6 with said tires for seven REAL north country Winters! Every other night call (more in the last two years) for 7 years, believe me, the road was often not plowed when I had to go in in the middle of the night.

I had Blizzaks on my 97 M3 (lived in New Hampshire and then in Malone) and they were very good. But they were terrible on dry roads! SQUISHY.

The Dunlop's handle on dry roads very nicely, and not as noisy as the Blizzaks!

I drove my A8L in Binghamton for three winters with all season tires so you are correct on that count. Our prior Siena Minivan and now our Q7 also driven with all seasons. Both AWD of course LOL.

Dunlops for me! I frequently drive over 130 mph in the winter. not really

Mike

[IS+1]

Originally Posted by Aronis

WRONG!

I lived in Malone, NY for 7 years, and drove my A6 sport and then RS6 with said tires for seven REAL north country Winters! Every other night call (more in the last two years) for 7 years, believe me, the road was often not plowed when I had to go in in the middle of the night.

I had Blizzaks on my 97 M3 (lived in New Hampshire and then in Malone) and they were very good. But they were terrible on dry roads! SQUISHY.

The Dunlop's handle on dry roads very nicely, and not as noisy as the Blizzaks!

I drove my A8L in Binghamton for three winters with all season tires so you are correct on that count. Our prior Siena Minivan and now our Q7 also driven with all seasons. Both AWD of course LOL.

Dunlops for me! I frequently drive over 130 mph in the winter. not really

Mike

I do believe everything you said, however have you used the Dunlops through a bad winter on a RWD car (i.e. not Audi)? Sorry I should have clarified that my comment was directed more at RWD cars. AWD operates on a whole different level in the snow - I had an A4 many years back

Yes I agree the Blizzaks suck in the dry.

[Aronis]

I still am hoping to have my RS back on the road for the winter driving.

My engine was out Oct to June this past year for an oil leak, ended up replacing a bunch of stuff but my mechanic talked me out of replacing THE TIME BOMB that he swore he replaced about 12k miles ago and 'checked'. Ended failing, lucky I did not loose the valves.

You learn things that one should not have to learn The Hard Way. These car manufactures KNOW there are parts that will fail over 100000 miles, we know it is pricy to replace them but at least WARN us....Hot Oil, Fast moving chain, Metal on plastic, D'ooh.....

[DKX4///M]

I thought 18"s rubbed the outer caliper? Good news for winter n for track

[IS+1]

Originally Posted by Aronis

I still am hoping to have my RS back on the road for the winter driving.

My engine was out Oct to June this past year for an oil leak, ended up replacing a bunch of stuff but my mechanic talked me out of replacing THE TIME BOMB that he swore he replaced about 12k miles ago and 'checked'. Ended failing, lucky I did not loose the valves.

You learn things that one should not have to learn The Hard Way. These car manufactures KNOW there are parts that will fail over 100000 miles, we know it is pricy to replace them but at least WARN us....Hot Oil, Fast moving chain, Metal on plastic, D'ooh.....

Wow that sucks!! Hope it is back on the road soon. Why was it out for 8 months - were you debating on whether to fix it? What preventative action could you have taken, and what time bomb did the mechanic say he "checked" but ultimately failed?

At least you have your M2 to keep you entertained!

[Aronis]

The Time bomb is the Cam Chain Tensioner, pictured above, the plastic guide wears down to the metal parts and then the metal chain cuts into the CCT, not good......

[Rudy@tirerack]

Originally Posted by IS+1

Based on Tire Rack's own data, the overall diameter of the stock rear PSSs is 26.3", whereas the overall diameter of the X-Ice 245/40/18 is 25.7". "Much" smaller is of course relative to the other differences I have listed. So with the X-Ice 245/40/18 your speedometer may over-read by a few clicks, but no big deal. I'm curious as to why he did not recommend the Blizzaks in the same size, since they have an overall diameter even closer to the stock rear PSSs. I'm sure the X-Ice will be fine, but I don't see why some of the others I've listed (esp. the Blizzaks in the same size) would not be recommended by Keith.

The only explanation I can think of is concern that the fronts will run into clearance issues since the stock front tires are slightly smaller than the stock rears, so the Blizzaks may be too big for the front...

Maybe Keith can weigh in?

Any 245/40/18 would work. I recommended the X-ice Xi3 because I have personally had very good success with this tire. The Blizzak WS80 is also an excellent winter tire, but the Michelin will handle better on dry roads and tends to wear longer. The WS80 tends to feel very mushy, while the Xi3 feels more like a standard tire on dry roads.

As for the size, any 245/40/18 would work.

[Rudy@tirerack]

If you would like to build your own package, click the link below. You can then select 18" packages and build your own package by selecting the tire of your choice and the wheel of your choice.
http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterP...ModClar=&a=BS4


If you live in an area where you really need the absolute best winter traction, I would recommend a studless ice and snow tire, something like the
Blizzak WS80:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

or
Michelin Xi3:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

If you live in an area where the roads are typically clear, but need a winter tire for the bad days; I would go with a performance winter tire as these will handle best on dry roads.
Two of the best -
Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

or
Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

[andrettifan]

Originally Posted by Keith@tirerack.com

If you would like to build your own package, click the link below. You can then select 18" packages and build your own package by selecting the tire of your choice and the wheel of your choice.
http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterP...ModClar=&a=BS4


If you live in an area where you really need the absolute best winter traction, I would recommend a studless ice and snow tire, something like the
Blizzak WS80:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

or
Michelin Xi3:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

If you live in an area where the roads are typically clear, but need a winter tire for the bad days; I would go with a performance winter tire as these will handle best on dry roads.
Two of the best -
Pirelli Winter Sottozero 3:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

or
Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....age=true?a=BS4

Keith - your tire options are great, but what's holding me back from ordering (and perhaps others as well) is that you only have one 18 inch wheel available for the M2 (the Rial P10). I'd like to order a wheel / tire package, but not crazy about that wheel. If we wait another month, is it likely that Tire Race will have more choices in 18 inch wheels (like the Apex for example)?

[Rudy@tirerack]

Originally Posted by andrettifan

Keith - your tire options are great, but what's holding me back from ordering (and perhaps others as well) is that you only have one 18 inch wheel available for the M2 (the Rial P10). I'd like to order a wheel / tire package, but not crazy about that wheel. If we wait another month, is it likely that Tire Race will have more choices in 18 inch wheels (like the Apex for example)?

That has been updated. We have several options available now.

To find the 18" wheels, follow these steps:
1. Click this link http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterP...ModClar=&a=BS4
2. Select build your own 18" package
3. It will first bring up the tires. Select the tire of your choice, click "add to package". (if you do not want to purchase tires, just select any one of them and then later remove from your cart)
4. Now it will bring up the 18" wheels. There are about 20 model to choose from. Once you select a wheel, add to cart.
5. Next it will ask you if you would like to add TPMS sensor and mount & balance.
6. Finally, you will be in the cart with your selections. (This is where you can delete the tires if you do not need tires)

[QM]

Originally Posted by Keith@tirerack.com

That has been updated. We have several options available now:
http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterW...tValue=1&a=BS4

All I see is the Rial P10 in 18 inch?

[TBURKE555]

Check out the Apex winter tire and wheel group buy on the M3/M4 forum

[andrettifan]

Originally Posted by Keith@tirerack.com

That has been updated. We have several options available now:
http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterW...tValue=1&a=BS4

The link to 18 inch wheel options is not working.

KEITH????

[Rudy@tirerack]

Originally Posted by andrettifan

The link to 18 inch wheel options is not working.

KEITH????

Sorry about that. Somehow the link got corrupt.

To find the 18" wheels, follow these steps:
1. Click this link http://www.tirerack.com/snow/WinterP...ModClar=&a=BS4
2. Select build your own 18" package
3. It will first bring up the tires. Select the tire of your choice, click "add to package". (if you do not want to purchase tires, just select any one of them and then later remove from your cart)
4. Now it will bring up the 18" wheels. There are about 20 model to choose from. Once you select a wheel, add to cart.
5. Next it will ask you if you would like to add TPMS sensor and mount & balance.
6. Finally, you will be in the cart with your selections. (This is where you can delete the tires if you do not need tires)

Sorry this process is not easier. I am checking with my web team to see if we can streamline this process now.

Feel free to call me or email me directly if you have any questions.
Thanks!

[DragM]

What are your opinions on the pirelli winter zero fr?