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      07-13-2015, 11:32 PM   #1
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Palmer Motor Sport Experience

I just got back from the track on Sunday and it was a big disappointment. My car was the slowest of them all. Even a stock Subaru WRX walk all over me.

The car is on A/S tires and it horrible with it! I wish I have gotten the RWD instead of the X Drive. This is great street car but not so much for the track. I will probably go again soon and get a set of new of the PSS tires to see if this will make any differences. The A/S tires is garbage for the track.

Lets not talk about the under steer with the Xdrive ....

Last edited by BBMMWW333; 07-14-2015 at 12:13 AM..
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      07-14-2015, 01:08 AM   #2
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The car can be great for the track, but it does require some TLC. A/S tires are a no-no, as you know. Some other mods are helpful, but you really need to be careful when you go on a track, as you have no idea what those other cars are packing. Sure, they look stock, but you don't know whats going on under the skin. People don't always tell you the truth about what is in their car.

Also, when I started tracking, I was getting pummeled by a lot of people, including people driving Miatas, FRS/BRZs, etc. Skill is a big factor here. Not saying that you are a bad driver (I have no idea), but just because someone is faster than you doesn't necessarily mean their car is faster than yours. I've had my clock cleaned by people with a 100 horsepower deficit; they were just better drivers than me. Also, some cars just require more skill to get the best out of them than others. WRX's have amazing power-trains and a ridiculous amount of grip. I've had more than one "stock" WRX kick my ass at the track. Driver was probably better, and the car might be easier to drive fast.

Just remember, its not a race. You are not in a race car. No one you are driving with is. It's just for fun. If you need to dial out some understeer, try switching tires or get some camber plates.
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      07-14-2015, 10:21 AM   #3
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I agree, the track day experience changed my view on other lower HP cars. I would never look at a STI or FRS on the road but this track day changed my view forever.

Just to fill with some background info,among my friends in the track group, I have the best lap time in karting events. But I have the slowest time in the track due to the tire issue. So I know is not the driving skill issue.

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      07-14-2015, 01:32 PM   #4
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I haven't had much track time with this car yet, but with my limited experience my thought is this, one word: tires

The stock A/S are somewhat okay on the street and in snow, but terrible when you push the car to race track levels. I put RE-11's on and it was like a whole new car (when at driving at the limits). Turn in is not like my old Spec Miata race car, but I don't think it's too bad. Out of any car I've ever driven I've never had one that could claw out of corner like this one. It's absolutely amazing.
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      07-17-2015, 08:12 PM   #5
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GTR886, how did you like the track? Is it hard on the brakes?

Looks like a pretty technical track from videos that I've seen.
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      07-17-2015, 08:15 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wjones14 View Post
GTR886, how did you like the track? Is it hard on the brakes?

Looks like a pretty technical track from videos that I've seen.
I really like the track. Its very technical and hard on breaks. As suggested by other members, high performance break fluid is a must.

I find the M235 breaks somewhat soft. I often find my self pressing the break all the way down to get decent stopping power. The stock break pad is actually good but the break peddle is very soft.

The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
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      07-17-2015, 08:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886 View Post
I really like the track. Its very technical and hard on breaks. As suggested by other members, high performance break fluid is a must.

I find the M235 breaks somewhat soft. I often find my self pressing the break all the way down to get decent stopping power. The stock break pad is actually good but the break peddle is very soft.

The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
well it might not be the brakes but the tires....
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      07-17-2015, 09:16 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886
Quote:
Originally Posted by wjones14 View Post
GTR886, how did you like the track? Is it hard on the brakes?

Looks like a pretty technical track from videos that I've seen.
I really like the track. Its very technical and hard on breaks. As suggested by other members, high performance break fluid is a must.

I find the M235 breaks somewhat soft. I often find my self pressing the break all the way down to get decent stopping power. The stock break pad is actually good but the break peddle is very soft.

The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
You need a faster track
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      07-18-2015, 12:13 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikcachu View Post
You need a faster track
Yeah, my x drive is limited at 130MPH
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      07-18-2015, 06:12 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886 View Post
Yeah, my x drive is limited at 130MPH
ah... right... A/S tires doesn't come with the removed speed limiter option 840
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      07-18-2015, 12:18 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886 View Post
The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
There's a video of a 2014 5.0 Mustang on YouTube on that track hitting 130 mph using Harry's lap timer telemetry overlay. I've seen other videos from that track, including an E36 M3 where they only hit about 110 however, so you're not far off. The horsepower in the Mustang really helped it in that long straight, plus the driver is an HPDE instructor and is quite talented.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D4GIzXoy_Y0

Tires, high-temp brake fluid, and practice should get you up to 115 or maybe even 120.
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      08-01-2015, 08:10 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886 View Post
I really like the track. Its very technical and hard on breaks. As suggested by other members, high performance break fluid is a must.

I find the M235 breaks somewhat soft. I often find my self pressing the break all the way down to get decent stopping power. The stock break pad is actually good but the break peddle is very soft.

The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
^^^^^top speed is 100-110mph in your car at Palmer?

Just for reference, I was there in May in my 228i. My top speed was just shy of 120mph.....and that was me backing off as it was my first time at the track, stock brakes and Michelin Super Sports.

As others, including yourself, have said, you need better rubber.......BUT you also need negative camber upfront. My car came with -0.1* camber in the front.....terrible! My RWD 228i Msport THP still understeers with a square wheel/tire package, springs, F8x LCA's and H&R sways.

Also for reference, I was doing times in the 2:02-2:05 range.
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      09-26-2015, 08:22 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTR886 View Post
I really like the track. Its very technical and hard on breaks. As suggested by other members, high performance break fluid is a must.

I find the M235 breaks somewhat soft. I often find my self pressing the break all the way down to get decent stopping power. The stock break pad is actually good but the break peddle is very soft.

The top speed for the stock M235 is about 100-110MPH at max for that track.
I brought my stock RWD M235i M6 to Palmer this week. I have done 7 HPDE events previously, but all in a 2005 Mustang GT. This was the first time the M235i was on the track, so I was learning both the track and the car.

I got up to 126 mph with a best lap of 2 minutes 3 seconds. No doubt some of the difference is tires - mine has the Michelin PSS with 3500 street miles on them. I didn't have any issues with braking - in fact I didn't find the track particularly hard on the brakes. The fastest braking area is at the end of the front straight after you hit the max speed, and that area is uphill, so you've got gravity assisting you. There are a lot of turns, but many of them just require a tap on the brake pedal to settle the car entering the turn.
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      11-22-2015, 07:34 PM   #14
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      11-22-2015, 07:36 PM   #15
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      11-22-2015, 07:39 PM   #16
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      04-01-2016, 06:43 PM   #17
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It's that time of year again. Who's heading to Palmer this year and when?

I'll be there May 14-15.
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      05-16-2016, 06:55 PM   #18
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Killer weekend at Palmer! This car continues to impress me.....and anyone else who gets in.

Saturday were perfect conditions. Sunday was a little cooler which meant more HP, but less grip.

Ended up running my quickest lap to date, 1:53.8.

The new RE-71R tires are amazing.

Can't wait to head back there in a couple more weeks.
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      05-16-2016, 06:59 PM   #19
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Ill be up there with Patroon BMWCCA October 15-16.
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      05-16-2016, 07:47 PM   #20
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Ill be up there with Patroon BMWCCA October 15-16.
I might go then as well. Can't get enough of this place!
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      05-16-2016, 08:02 PM   #21
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Killer weekend at Palmer! This car continues to impress me.....and anyone else who gets in.

Saturday were perfect conditions. Sunday was a little cooler which meant more HP, but less grip.

Ended up running my quickest lap to date, 1:53.8.

The new RE-71R tires are amazing.

Can't wait to head back there in a couple more weeks.
you like them huh?
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      05-18-2016, 07:43 PM   #22
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^^^the RE-71R's are awesome! So far I'm very impressed.
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