[Silvermike]

Guys. I noticed something a bit odd the other day. When I place my car into sport + mode I get partial tcs/dsc. I then hold the tcs off button for a few seconds to fully switch the tcs/dsc off. however in doing so my car got knocked out of sport+ mode. My throttle response felt as if it were back in comfort mode or something. Has anyone else experienced this? Is there a way to get the sharpness of sport mode with dsc completely off?

[MrBucket]

Yep DSC off you get the slower throttle

[rich8566]

Yes and no, respectfully.

[Silvermike]

Thanks for the responses. Well this sucks

[2msport]

I noticed this today too. Also, Don't try and do donuts without turning DSC off. LOL sport + will not work

[Liquidpaper]

No, there isn't, and it's for track use. Easier throttle modulation is good for the track, but they should have at least given us an option. DSC off is a separate mode onto itself. Think of DSC off mode as track mode.

[Silvermike]

Originally Posted by Liquidpaper

No, there isn't, and it's for track use. Easier throttle modulation is good for the track, but they should have at least given us an option. DSC off is a separate mode onto itself. Think of DSC off mode as track mode.

Good point. But what about the shifts? For auto. Isn't the shifts more aggressive in sport plus? What about engine mapping and such? I thought the lower modes were more economy vs performance?

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Silvermike

Good point. But what about the shifts? For auto. Isn't the shifts more aggressive in sport plus? What about engine mapping and such? I thought the lower modes were more economy vs performance?

It expects you to be shifting manually on your paddles when the DSC is off, so aggressively shifting doesn't matter because you are controlling the shifts. At least that's my understanding. Unless someone else can chime in.


Also attached is a helpful chart for the modes

[Silvermike]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

It expects you to be shifting manually on your paddles when the DSC is off, so aggressively shifting doesn't matter because you are controlling the shifts. At least that's my understanding. Unless someone else can chime in.


Also attached is a helpful chart for the modes

Thx scout. this really explains it all.

[Gatte]

Originally Posted by Silvermike

Good point. But what about the shifts? For auto. Isn't the shifts more aggressive in sport plus? What about engine mapping and such? I thought the lower modes were more economy vs performance?

I might have gotten a little confused since I took delivery at the Welt but what I was told was that in Sport+ and with the DSC completely off, you can completely control how your car shifts by moving the shift lever to the left while driving. Once you tap it to the left and do one downshift, the car will hold the gear. It will not shift unless you do it yourself.

What he said is and I quote "In this mode, the car will not downshift or assist you during cornering. You might be dead in a ditch but they will stay switched off".

Again, I don't remember exactly what settings they were. I distinctly remember what he said though with that German Accent. Can't wait to check it out when my car gets back.

[Silvermike]

Originally Posted by Gatte

I might have gotten a little confused since I took delivery at the Welt but what I was told was that in Sport+ and with the DSC completely off, you can completely control how your car shifts by moving the shift lever to the left while driving. Once you tap it to the left and do one downshift, the car will hold the gear. It will not shift unless you do it yourself.

What he said is and I quote "In this mode, the car will not downshift or assist you during cornering. You might be dead in a ditch but they will stay switched off".

Again, I don't remember exactly what settings they were. I distinctly remember what he said though with that German Accent. Can't wait to check it out when my car gets back.

My car is a 6MT, so no worries about the shifts for me. I was more concerned with the car being on a less aggressive map than in sport plus. I definitely feel the laziness in the throttle response when DSC is off... That alone makes the car feel "slower"

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Silvermike

My car is a 6MT, so no worries about the shifts for me. I was more concerned with the car being on a less aggressive map than in sport plus. I definitely feel the laziness in the throttle response when DSC is off... That alone makes the car feel "slower"

But on the track that will allow for better throttle control. You shouldn't really need to throw DSC off unless YOU ARE ON THE TRACK. Normal sport + mode is good for street driving although I rarely find myself above Sport

[Silvermike]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

But on the track that will allow for better throttle control. You shouldn't really need to throw DSC off unless YOU ARE ON THE TRACK. Normal sport + mode is good for street driving although I rarely find myself above Sport

I should note I noticed the throttle response mid drift 2 days ago while playing in the rain

Here in trinidad there is no track.

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Silvermike

I should note I noticed the throttle response mid drift 2 days ago while playing in the rain

Here in trinidad there is no track.

Hahaha love it

[scottomfg]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

Also attached is a helpful chart for the modes

That chart shows DSC as 'Active' in Sport +, but that is not correct. Here is the page from the M235i manual showing DSC is off in Sport+.

[Liquidpaper]

BTW, I think on the M235i the exhaust is set to aggro on DSC off. I've come off the track and my exhaust (MPE) sounds like some caged monster with a cap gun with all the gurgles and pops/bangs.

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by scottomfg

That chart shows DSC as 'Active' in Sport +, but that is not correct. Here is the page from the M235i manual showing DSC is off in Sport+.

Unless the system has changed I've always been under the impression and been told by BMW that sport + doesn't technically turn DSC OFF completely. It relaxes it and the indicator turns on so you know that you know you will have reduced control by the computer. The only way to turn DSC completely off is to Hold the button for a couple seconds. And I don't think that's in the manual. And in fact I've tested this out. In sport + mode when I start sliding too much the DSC kicks in. With DSC completely OFF i will spin out completely in the same circumstances. (Had a rainy parking lot the other day).

If this wasn't the case, it would make no sense that turning the DSC off would throw you out of sport + mode? Why wouldn't the car just turn it back in and kick you out? Which it doesn't.

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

Unless the system has changed I've always been under the impression and been told by BMW that sport + doesn't technically turn DSC OFF completely. It relaxes it and the indicator turns on so you know that you know you will have reduced control by the computer. The only way to turn DSC completely off is to Hold the button for a couple seconds. And I don't think that's in the manual. And in fact I've tested this out. In sport + mode when I start sliding too much the DSC kicks in. With DSC completely OFF i will spin out completely in the same circumstances. (Had a rainy parking lot the other day).

If this wasn't the case, it would make no sense that turning the DSC off would throw you out of sport + mode? Why wouldn't the car just turn it back in and kick you out? Which it doesn't.

As you can see from below the DSC off indicator doubles as a DSC completely off indicator OR a DTC traction control activated indicator depending on what mode you are in.

This when it turns on in Sport + it's letting you know you turned on the DTC traction control which means your DSC is still active in the background.

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

As you can see from below the DSC off indicator doubles as a DSC completely off indicator OR a DTC traction control activated indicator depending on what mode you are in.

This when it turns on in Sport + it's letting you know you turned on the DTC traction control which means your DSC is still active in the background.

And when DTC is active DSC is still running in the background. Look below

And the description literally above what you screenshot says that in Sport +, Traction is activated, which means if you follow the logic that DSC is still activated in the background. KEY WORDS: "the driver handles SEVERAL of the stabilization tasks" not ALL that is because DSC is still active in the background.

So yeah it is "correct"

[Thescout13]

And just to drive home it home for any other doubters out there or people who want to learn how it works....

[scottomfg]

None of those screenshots are showing what you think they are showing. I think this is a name issue that we are bumping up against.

DSC is the mode on the car where all nannies are fully active and will intervene at the drop of a hat. It is active in Comfort and Sport Mode.

DTC is a fallback mode for the nannies that lets the car get a little more loose before intervening and appears to prioritize forward momentum in controlling traction, with less concern about going sideways. Everything DTC does is already included in DSC, but everything in DSC is NOT included in DTC. DTC automatically becomes active when you turn DSC off, and is active in Sport+ mode. DSC is off in Sport+ mode.

DTC off (which also means DSC is off) is it's own mode.

When the manual says that the DSC OFF light means "DSC Dynamic Stability Control is deactivated or DTC Dynamic Traction Control is activated." that 'or' is the same 'or' you find when someone says you can call a single thing by two different names, NOT when you can call two different things by one name. Blame translation from German here most likely. It means when that light is on DSC is OFF (of course since it says DSC OFF) and that DTC is Enabled.

[Silvermike]

^^ DTC is definitely active with DSC off in sport+. it was pooping all over my sideways parade.