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      10-16-2014, 11:07 PM   #1
Duster
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Best winter tires?

Looking for the best winter tires. Definitely want the most traction I can get, while maintaining some handling and performance.

Weather here in Toronto is all over the place - snow, slush, ice, and many dry days too. The one constant is the cold.

Leaning towards Michelin x-ice, but also considering blizzak Ws80 or LM25, among others.

Probably want to go with H rated tires as compromise between traction and performance.

Need some advice. What tires have people chosen, or work well on other high powered RWD cars?
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      10-16-2014, 11:36 PM   #2
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I'm in KW, so nearby in terms of weather conditions, perhaps more snow outside of the GTA. Although I'm sure our colleagues in Ottawa, Montreal, Calgary, Edmonton will be along shortly to say we don't know from snow

I voted with my wallet on Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4s. Will have to see how they fare. Have x-drive on my vehicle too. I had X-Ice 3's and AWD on my previous vehicle, they were okay. Don't think I can recall a moment thinking "man these things are sticking like summers".

I looked at reviews @ APA, Consumer Reports, some of the car rags, owner reviews...Michelin consistently comes out on top or near the top across the sources. I was really pleased with the PS3s on my previous vehicle and am going with this on a bit of brand preference.

Although have to say I've been pleasantly surprised at the traction on the stock P-Zero's. Don't hear any squealing so far in my driving or the rainy conditions of late.

http://www.apa.ca/WinterTires2013-PassengerCars.asp
http://www.apa.ca/WinterTires2011-Performance.asp
http://www.moderntiredealer.com/blog...-the-pack.aspx
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...4-99047474.htm
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...s-overview.htm
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/c...s-overview.htm

I don't think you can go wrong though on the X-Ice 3's. They're always at the top of lists too...

Last edited by haloeight; 10-16-2014 at 11:45 PM..
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      10-17-2014, 06:16 AM   #3
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I got the BMW Canada recommended OEM style 380 wheels with Continental Winter Contact TS830P tires (performance winter tires) in 205/50/17 (so narrower and much higher profile). Installed last week as temperature hit 2 degrees a couple nights... Ride is more bouncy and more road noise but handled well at 120+ kmph ... haven't driven in rain yet.

{My PSS def needed warming up on cold mornings but gripped well during a couple heavy down pours on the highway at 120+ kmph}

I drive my car hard and expect a lot out of my tires.
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      10-17-2014, 08:04 AM   #4
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Anybody driving the Pirelli W210 Sottozero Serie 2 Runflat? It's expensive, but it's caught my eye as a tire that might have very little compromise. H-rated, but still seems to be a high performer.
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      10-17-2014, 08:20 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2+3=5 View Post
I got the BMW Canada recommended OEM style 380 wheels with Continental Winter Contact TS830P tires (performance winter tires) in 205/50/17 (so narrower and much higher profile). Installed last week as temperature hit 2 degrees a couple nights... Ride is more bouncy and more road noise but handled well at 120+ kmph ... haven't driven in rain yet.

{My PSS def needed warming up on cold mornings but gripped well during a couple heavy down pours on the highway at 120+ kmph}

I drive my car hard and expect a lot out of my tires.
Can you post a pic of those tires on your car?
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      10-17-2014, 08:33 AM   #6
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Haloeight: Thanks for your links, above! Really helpful information.

So, I've been narrowing it down. I'm going to stick with H-rated tires because this car is going to need all the help it can get in the winter, and I'll trade a bit of performance for traction. I had H rated Toyos on my G37 last winter, and they were good for all but a few days of heavy snow, in which case I don't think any tire would have worked.

So my choices as of now are:

Continental Barum Polaris 3
Bridgestone Blizzak WS80
Michelin X-Ice X-i3
Bridgestone Blizzak LM25

Thoughts? Any strong leader in that list? Any that should be struck off or added?
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      10-17-2014, 10:19 AM   #7
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      10-17-2014, 10:28 AM   #8
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The LM25 will give you somewhat better performance when conditions permit.

Several reviews and posts have pointed out that the WS80s are excellent, but... the grippy rubber compound is a spray application covering about 50% of tread depth which, after that amount of wear, begins to lose its superior grip. Still a great winter tire.

http://tires.about.com/od/TireReview...izzak-WS80.htm

You might also consider the Nokian line. They are a Finnish company. I'm currently looking at the Nokian Hakkapellitas (full-on winter tire) and the WRG3s, which are an intriguing "all-weather" category (not all-season) which are fully winter-rated, but can be used year-round. Apparently they have an 80,000 km warranty, and are sold exclusively in Canada by Kal Tire.

https://shop.kaltire.com/tiresdetails2/tireid/8145/

Globe & Mail review:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...ticle16190526/

I believe Consumer Reports ranked the WRG3s third among all winter tires tested in a fairly recent (past 2 years?) review, but I can't find the link just now.

Caveat: I'm in Windsor and we get less snow compared to points north. Last winter was an exception. So I'm pondering whether the "all-weather" WRG3s hit the sweet spot for me as a winter tire. I have the Michelin PSS for summer. YMMV.
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      10-17-2014, 12:28 PM   #9
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Curious, anyone have any input on the Dunlop Winter Sport 3D/4D? The Dunlop along with the Blizzak WS80, LM32 and Michelin Alpin PA4 have been really popular among our customers.
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      10-17-2014, 01:00 PM   #10
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      10-17-2014, 09:03 PM   #11
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I had the Dunlop 3D's on my old GTI and they worked very well in all kinds of snow and ice. I had Bridgestone LM25's on my E36 M3 and they worked well too but I never took that car out into really bad snow. Had the Bridgestone WS multicell snows on a previous E36 325i and they worked great in snow but killed the handling of the car. I just bought LM32's for my 228.
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      10-18-2014, 08:42 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VMRWheels View Post
Curious, anyone have any input on the Dunlop Winter Sport 3D/4D? The Dunlop along with the Blizzak WS80, LM32 and Michelin Alpin PA4 have been really popular among our customers.
I ran the Dunlop winter sport M3 and they may be slightly different then the 3d but they were great. But just like the WS80 once that grippy compound wears at about 50-60% they are sort of like an all season tire. Pretty much loose that grip in the snow. Hope this helps.
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      10-18-2014, 05:32 PM   #13
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The Dunlop 3/4D's are performance winter so they do not have the extra grippy surface that wears away quickly, and they retain most of the handling of the car. The Dunlop Winter Max is the studless snow rated tire like the WS80. I had the 3D's on my GTI for 6 seasons before I sold the car, and they probably had 1 more season in them. And I lived in a heavy snow area west/north of Boston.
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      10-19-2014, 10:32 AM   #14
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Nokian Hakka. Others are not even close...
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      10-20-2014, 09:40 AM   #15
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Tried Bridgestone Blizzaks today in my friends company VW and the noise from them is just terrible. Also the handling is quite odd. It's like they were 10 - 15 years old technology.

I know these are not allowed in Canada or U.S. (or in many other countries) but answer to the original question, these are the best winter tires: Studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 8. Can't wait the ice and snow and huge powerslides.

Just got the M Perf LSD installed for winter as well but it's another story...
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      10-20-2014, 10:00 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingFinn View Post
Nokian Hakka. Others are not even close...
+ 1

Been running them ever since I have had RWD bimmers (6 years and counting). Never looked back. I ran Pirellis (good on dry roads, scary on ice and snow). ran blizzaks ( a while back, but really scary on snow).
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      10-20-2014, 10:32 AM   #17
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Has anyone here run the Nokian WRG3?
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      10-20-2014, 01:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dd1981 View Post
I ran the Dunlop winter sport M3 and they may be slightly different then the 3d but they were great. But just like the WS80 once that grippy compound wears at about 50-60% they are sort of like an all season tire. Pretty much loose that grip in the snow. Hope this helps.
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      10-20-2014, 04:34 PM   #19
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The Nokian Hakkas look good, but the only ones I can find are "R" speed rated. I've never used anything less than an H rated tire on a performance car.

Why do these have such a low speed rating, and does that mean they're going to handle badly?
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      10-21-2014, 11:11 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duster View Post
The Nokian Hakkas look good, but the only ones I can find are "R" speed rated. I've never used anything less than an H rated tire on a performance car.

Why do these have such a low speed rating, and does that mean they're going to handle badly?
Not 100 % sure but I think it is due to rubber compound of the tyre. Softer compound gives more grip and lower speed rating. This does not have to do anything with handling or wear of the tyre.
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      10-21-2014, 07:17 PM   #21
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I'm in Toronto as well.

Researched forever and went with 225/45/17 Nokian Hakkapeliitta R2s.

This will be my first winter without AWD in about a decade so I wanted to be prepared. Last winter was brutal.
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      10-21-2014, 07:57 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duster View Post
The Nokian Hakkas look good, but the only ones I can find are "R" speed rated. I've never used anything less than an H rated tire on a performance car.

Why do these have such a low speed rating, and does that mean they're going to handle badly?
I think one reason they have low speed rating is winter tread design creates heat at higher speeds which in turn means greater chance of high speed failure. And since snow tires have less surface contact high speed braking is compromised.
Handle badly? Handling w/dedicated winter tires is going to be different, the winter tread kind of acts like a spring so hard cornering, braking and hard acceleration are all compromised.

I thought R rated tires were for light trucks
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