Next Level Auto Brokers
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   BMW M3 and BMW M4 Forum > BMW F80 M3 / F82 M4 Technical Topics > Navigation, iDrive, Audio, Video, Bluetooth, Phone, Cameras, Electronics

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-21-2014, 10:54 AM   #1
GregW / Oregon
Commander-In-Chief
2070
Rep
8,898
Posts

Drives: 2023 M2 Coupe, 2020 GLE 450
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Lake Oswego, OR

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Best lidar shifter?

What are the best lidar defense systems. I've heard the Blinder HP-905 is good.
__________________

Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA
2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 11:37 AM   #2
budpaul
Private
7
Rep
62
Posts

Drives: 2015 M3, 2007 328i
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tampa/FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
What are the best lidar defense systems. I've heard the Blinder HP-905 is good.
From what I have been reading Antilaser Priority seems to be the best atm.
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 12:11 PM   #3
GregW / Oregon
Commander-In-Chief
2070
Rep
8,898
Posts

Drives: 2023 M2 Coupe, 2020 GLE 450
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Lake Oswego, OR

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Blinder vs. Antilaser

Quote:
Originally Posted by budpaul View Post
From what I have been reading Antilaser Priority seems to be the best atm.
I've heard they use the same sensors.
__________________

Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA
2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 12:22 PM   #4
GregW / Oregon
Commander-In-Chief
2070
Rep
8,898
Posts

Drives: 2023 M2 Coupe, 2020 GLE 450
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Lake Oswego, OR

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Blinder vs. Antilaser

Quote:
Originally Posted by budpaul View Post
From what I have been reading Antilaser Priority seems to be the best atm.
Got this from a technical geek friend who researched systems for his Porsche, for what it's worth.

"This company (Antilaser) is fairly new and has not been open for more than one year. They pay Blinder royalties for use of their seven series technology, which is three years old and is an outdated technology (and the price they are charging is through the roof). Call Bonnie at Blinder Xtreme at 866-622-7219, she has been doing this for over thirteen years and knows everything out there regarding laser defeat systems. The patents for the technology, I believe, are from Blinder of Belgium.

I did quite a bit of research on this and always ended back at Blinder when identifying which product was the best technology and most up to date.

I actually purchased my units through Radar Roy, who has some excellent videos showing how the product performs as well as similar products from other manufacturer's. I found out later that I could have saved some money by dealing direct with Blinder Xtreme of Florida, where Radar Roy sources his inventory."
__________________

Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA
2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 01:49 PM   #5
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Got this from a technical geek friend who researched systems for his Porsche, for what it's worth.

"This company (Antilaser) is fairly new and has not been open for more than one year. They pay Blinder royalties for use of their seven series technology, which is three years old and is an outdated technology (and the price they are charging is through the roof). Call Bonnie at Blinder Xtreme at 866-622-7219, she has been doing this for over thirteen years and knows everything out there regarding laser defeat systems. The patents for the technology, I believe, are from Blinder of Belgium.

I did quite a bit of research on this and always ended back at Blinder when identifying which product was the best technology and most up to date.

I actually purchased my units through Radar Roy, who has some excellent videos showing how the product performs as well as similar products from other manufacturer's. I found out later that I could have saved some money by dealing direct with Blinder Xtreme of Florida, where Radar Roy sources his inventory."
Antilaser has been in existence for far longer than just one year. They haven't been selling in the US for a few years but got back into the US market just late last year with the AL Priority. Yes, there was a patent dispute and yes they paid royalties to Blinder. That was for pulse rate table lookup method. This does not work for the latest lidar guns but Antilaser has a patent pending for a technology that deals with the latest threats.

The AL Priority is the hottest lidar countermeasure right now. If the HP 905 would be updated maybe they might be as good. However, I don't believe they've had a firmware update in over a year, maybe two. The HP905 is NOT the most up to date technology in this fast moving field. The ALP is effective on nearly every lidar gun (maybe even ALL to date but not willing to stick my neck out on this since laser guns are always being updated), whereas the HP 905 fails on many current models. The laser interceptor is more effective than the HP 905, and nearly, but not completely as effective as the ALP. The Escort shifter pro seems to be a re-packaged laser interceptor. There are others, such as the K40, but these are really not worth mentioning.

As always, with these things the key to success is installation and testing and adjusting the installation for best results. And don't think these things will make you ticket proof. They just buy you a bit of time to adjust your driving. It's still up to you to modify you driving behavior to stay away from speeding citations.


Cheers,

Ersin
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 05:07 PM   #6
SuckaGDog
Captain
128
Rep
617
Posts

Drives: M5, C63 AMG Black Series
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: DFW, TX

iTrader: (0)

ALP or Laser Interceptor.

I have Blinders on my M5 and they have been great, but like mentioned above they hardly release firmware updates.
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 05:39 PM   #7
GregW / Oregon
Commander-In-Chief
2070
Rep
8,898
Posts

Drives: 2023 M2 Coupe, 2020 GLE 450
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Lake Oswego, OR

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
Antilaser has been in existence for far longer than just one year. They haven't been selling in the US for a few years but got back into the US market just late last year with the AL Priority. Yes, there was a patent dispute and yes they paid royalties to Blinder. That was for pulse rate table lookup method. This does not work for the latest lidar guns but Antilaser has a patent pending for a technology that deals with the latest threats.

The AL Priority is the hottest lidar countermeasure right now. If the HP 905 would be updated maybe they might be as good. However, I don't believe they've had a firmware update in over a year, maybe two. The HP905 is NOT the most up to date technology in this fast moving field. The ALP is effective on nearly every lidar gun (maybe even ALL to date but not willing to stick my neck out on this since laser guns are always being updated), whereas the HP 905 fails on many current models. The laser interceptor is more effective than the HP 905, and nearly, but not completely as effective as the ALP. The Escort shifter pro seems to be a re-packaged laser interceptor. There are others, such as the K40, but these are really not worth mentioning.
As with most issues of this type, there is a lot of conflicting information. This from "Radar Roy" Reyer in response:

Total BS

According to Blinder, ALP never paid up, that is why there is a pending court case.

As far as not having any firmware updates that is BS too. In this video the Blinder jammed the Dragon Eye: http://www.radardetector.org/2014-laser-jammer-shoot/

I have no prejudices on this subject; just trying to make a smart purchase.
__________________

Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA
2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450

Last edited by GregW / Oregon; 07-21-2014 at 09:21 PM..
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 07:23 PM   #8
budpaul
Private
7
Rep
62
Posts

Drives: 2015 M3, 2007 328i
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tampa/FL

iTrader: (0)

Agree with you GregW - I am in same boat and reviewed alot of the jammers-good to get more info
Appreciate 0
      07-21-2014, 07:39 PM   #9
budpaul
Private
7
Rep
62
Posts

Drives: 2015 M3, 2007 328i
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tampa/FL

iTrader: (0)

http://radarandlaserforum.com/showth...-Compact-LIDAR

Unless Antilaser is fraudulent -it Jams the dragoneye to gun.
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2014, 03:47 PM   #10
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
As with most issues of this type, there is a lot of conflicting information. This from "Radar Roy" Reyer in response:

Total BS

According to Blinder, ALP never paid up, that is why there is a pending court case.

As far as not having any firmware updates that is BS too. In this video the Blinder jammed the Dragon Eye: http://www.radardetector.org/2014-laser-jammer-shoot/

I have no prejudices on this subject; just trying to make a smart purchase.
Whatever with Blinder. I won't get into it.

You should know that Radar Roy owns radardetector.org and also sells these countermeasures. There is only one internet retailer for the ALP in the US and it is not Roy. Google and check out other jammer "shoot out" results on the internet.

For a real unbiased assessment you should do your own testing. Hang out at rdforum dot net, get to know some of the guys from the forum in your area with lidar guns and then test against them. Go to some of the meet ups they have periodically with several different guns and see the results first hand. I guarantee that if you believe Roy's results the meets will be an eye opener.

I'm not having prejudices either. But facts are facts.


Cheers.
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2014, 03:49 PM   #11
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by budpaul View Post
http://radarandlaserforum.com/showth...-Compact-LIDAR

Unless Antilaser is fraudulent -it Jams the dragoneye to gun.
Not fraudulent! FWIW, that forum is owned by the US dealer rep for AL. Still good info though and the first place to look for support if you have the ALP.


Cheers.
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2014, 04:12 PM   #12
GregW / Oregon
Commander-In-Chief
2070
Rep
8,898
Posts

Drives: 2023 M2 Coupe, 2020 GLE 450
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Lake Oswego, OR

iTrader: (3)

Garage List
Lidar jammer choices

Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
Whatever with Blinder. I won't get into it.

You should know that Radar Roy owns radardetector.org and also sells these countermeasures. There is only one internet retailer for the ALP in the US and it is not Roy. Google and check out other jammer "shoot out" results on the internet.

For a real unbiased assessment you should do your own testing. Hang out at rdforum dot net, get to know some of the guys from the forum in your area with lidar guns and then test against them. Go to some of the meet ups they have periodically with several different guns and see the results first hand. I guarantee that if you believe Roy's results the meets will be an eye opener.

I'm not having prejudices either. But facts are facts.

Cheers.
All good information. In the end everyone has to digest and make their own conclusions. Frankly, either system is likely to be most anyone needs 95% of the time, IMO, assuming you are also driving smartly.
__________________

Greg Lake Oswego, Oregon, USA
2023 M2 Coupe - Brooklyn Grey/Cognac/CF, 6MT; 2020 MB GLE 450
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2014, 04:41 PM   #13
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
All good information. In the end everyone has to digest and make their own conclusions. Frankly, either system is likely to be most anyone needs 95% of the time, IMO, assuming you are also driving smartly.
To add more information to the fray:

The HP905 may be all you need if the guns that it cannot jam are not encountered where you drive. For the ones that it works against, it works well. The set of guns the laser interceptor works against is larger than that of the HP905. And the ALP, larger still.

However, you need to know what guns are being used where you drive. The aforementioned forum can help with this. You could also get a Whistler CR85 or CR90. These detectors show you the lidar pulse rate and from there you can figure out what is being used. You can also search for purchase orders from the police department that you encounter which could tell you what products are being used.

But the beauty of the ALP is that since it works against all devices currently (I'll say maybe all -- as I said before this is a fast changing field) you just get it and don't worry what's out there. Another nice thing about the ALP is that when a new gun is encountered there are ways that the ALP can learn the new patterns and the information can be sent back to Antilaser. So far, they've been very fast in getting out firmware updates that take care of new guns.

Bear in mind that for any lidar jamming countermeasure installation is extremely important. You really should find someone with a lidar gun to test and help you fine tune your installation. It is not as simple as sticking a radar detector up on the windshield.

Again, good luck.


Cheers.
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-22-2014, 06:30 PM   #14
Deviant
Second Lieutenant
35
Rep
285
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Roseville

iTrader: (0)

All great info as I've been looking into this as well.

Quick dumb question - do all of these come with an "off switch" so that when my V1 goes off that I'm being hit with laser and my laser jammer is blocking that I can quickly slow down and turn it off so if he hits me again it shows my true and safe speed? I know they aren't legal in CA and so would rather them get an actual reading, just after I slow down enough and turn it off.
Appreciate 0
      07-23-2014, 10:03 AM   #15
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviant View Post
All great info as I've been looking into this as well.

Quick dumb question - do all of these come with an "off switch" so that when my V1 goes off that I'm being hit with laser and my laser jammer is blocking that I can quickly slow down and turn it off so if he hits me again it shows my true and safe speed? I know they aren't legal in CA and so would rather them get an actual reading, just after I slow down enough and turn it off.
That's not a dumb question at all. The answer is yes, they all do have an off switch which you should use once you've verified your speed during an alert. The HP 905 has a rotary switch where you can turn off jamming but keep alerts on. This is absolutely what you should be doing. Use those switches. We call this JTK (jam to kill) versus JTG (jam to gun) where you just leave it on giving the LEO a clue to the existence of your lidar shifter.

The AL and LI also have a setting where they will automatically turn off after about 3 or 4 seconds of jamming then reset themselves after about 30 seconds. Don't quote me on the actual numbers on this -- they are all slightly different.


Cheers.
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-24-2014, 08:43 PM   #16
Deviant
Second Lieutenant
35
Rep
285
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Roseville

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
That's not a dumb question at all. The answer is yes, they all do have an off switch which you should use once you've verified your speed during an alert. The HP 905 has a rotary switch where you can turn off jamming but keep alerts on. This is absolutely what you should be doing. Use those switches. We call this JTK (jam to kill) versus JTG (jam to gun) where you just leave it on giving the LEO a clue to the existence of your lidar shifter.

The AL and LI also have a setting where they will automatically turn off after about 3 or 4 seconds of jamming then reset themselves after about 30 seconds. Don't quote me on the actual numbers on this -- they are all slightly different.


Cheers.

Great info thanks ersin.

Where are you guys mounting the sensors? I was looking at the AL Priority with 5 sensors as I'd want as much coverage as possible. Where on the M3 would you mount them?

Also, if this package was purchased is this everything one would need?

http://www.alpriorityusa.com/AL-Prio...ng-System.html

Not sure what the LCC Sensor does and am not quite sure why you'd need the Display as it's already making an audible sound correct?
Appreciate 0
      07-25-2014, 10:24 AM   #17
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviant View Post
Great info thanks ersin.

Where are you guys mounting the sensors? I was looking at the AL Priority with 5 sensors as I'd want as much coverage as possible. Where on the M3 would you mount them?

Also, if this package was purchased is this everything one would need?

http://www.alpriorityusa.com/AL-Prio...ng-System.html

Not sure what the LCC Sensor does and am not quite sure why you'd need the Display as it's already making an audible sound correct?
With the ALP there is no need for five sensors on the M3/M4 -- two up front, two in the back should work fine. I'd mount the heads up front in the grill, but I don't know if they will fit between the grill elements if you mount it horizontally like you should. I am hoping someone will try it out so we will all know. Mounting the heads vertically is not optimal but will work. They should be as far out to the side as possible (the last or next to last grill element, e.g. near the ///M3 emblem for the driver side and corresponding place on passenger side). In the rear mounting them above the license on the outside as far out as possible should work ok.

The package you refer to has everything you need. There are options but it's up to you if you want them or not. The LCC is for those cars that have the driver assist nannies. Some of these use laser and this will use the fifth head to monitor this and notify the ALP not to alert to the cars own driver aid laser signals. However, I don't think the driver aids on the M3/M4 use lidar, only radar, so LCC should not be needed even if you have the driver assist package. However, the driver assist package may set off radar detectors. Possibly inside the car, but definitely for others on the road. Good luck.


Cheers.
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.

Last edited by ersin; 07-25-2014 at 03:25 PM..
Appreciate 0
      07-25-2014, 12:52 PM   #18
4/3rds
Lieutenant
4/3rds's Avatar
United_States
21
Rep
496
Posts

Drives: 2015 BMW M4 (transporting)
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Oklahoma

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
With the ALP there is no need for five sensors on the M3/M4 -- two up front, two in the back should work fine. I'd mount the heads up front in the grill, but I don't know if they will fit between the grill elements if you mount it horizontally like you should. I am hoping someone will try it out so we will all know. Mounting the heads vertically is not optimal but will work. They should be as far out to the side as possible (the last or next to last grill element, e.g. near the ///M3 emblem for the driver side and corresponding place on passenger side). In the rear mounting them above the license on the outside as far out as possible should work ok.

The package you refer to has everything you need. There are options but it's up to you if you want them or not. The LCC is for those cars that have the driver assist nannies. Some of these use laser and this will use the fifth head to monitor this and notify the ALP not to alert to the cars own driver aid laser signals. However, I don't think the driver aids on the M3/M4 use lidar, only radar, so LCC should not be needed even if you have the driver assist package. However, the package may set off radar detectors. Possibly inside the car, but definitely for others on the road. Good luck.


Cheers.
My M4 arrives next week and I have the ALP waiting to install. I'll post pics when done.
Appreciate 0
      07-25-2014, 04:04 PM   #19
ersin
Brigadier General
ersin's Avatar
United_States
124
Rep
4,145
Posts

Drives: 17 YMB F80 M3
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (1)

I just want to clear some stuff up. I know some people that work with Antilaser and I've been checking with them about what has been said here so let me present their side.

Antilaser has been in business since 1998. They have been doing this stuff for 16 years. I don't know how old the others are but AL has been in it since the beginning. You can verify all of this yourself; their headquarters are in Croatia.

Second, AL has never been sued by Blinder and there is no pending lawsuit. If someone says otherwise please show me the evidence.

Third, it shouldn't need to be said but ALP and Blinder heads are not the same. They are similar in dimension and this may have thrown some people off.

Lastly, AL has their own patents in the US and Internationally. Some patents are still pending because they are very new which means they have technology that nobody else yet has.

I'm not trying to be a cheerleader for AL but the facts need to be set straight. Thanks.


Cheers,

Ersin
__________________
2017 F80 YMB.
Appreciate 0
      07-25-2014, 10:25 PM   #20
Swancoat
Lieutenant
136
Rep
504
Posts

Drives: E92 M3
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Houston

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
With the ALP there is no need for five sensors on the M3/M4 -- two up front, two in the back should work fine. I'd mount the heads up front in the grill, but I don't know if they will fit between the grill elements if you mount it horizontally like you should. I am hoping someone will try it out so we will all know. Mounting the heads vertically is not optimal but will work. They should be as far out to the side as possible (the last or next to last grill element, e.g. near the ///M3 emblem for the driver side and corresponding place on passenger side). In the rear mounting them above the license on the outside as far out as possible should work ok.

The package you refer to has everything you need. There are options but it's up to you if you want them or not. The LCC is for those cars that have the driver assist nannies. Some of these use laser and this will use the fifth head to monitor this and notify the ALP not to alert to the cars own driver aid laser signals. However, I don't think the driver aids on the M3/M4 use lidar, only radar, so LCC should not be needed even if you have the driver assist package. However, the driver assist package may set off radar detectors. Possibly inside the car, but definitely for others on the road. Good luck.


Cheers.
It's been a long time since I was looking at these things, so forgive me if the facts have changed or anything, but I believe Laser Interceptor sold a 'BMW' specific set of their heads with the internals mounted 90 deg from the regular ones with the expressed intent of being mounted vertically in the grills.
Appreciate 0
      07-26-2014, 01:14 AM   #21
GrussGott
Lieutenant General
GrussGott's Avatar
United_States
18113
Rep
11,746
Posts

Drives: 2018 M4 Comp Indv
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Newport Beach

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Radar Roy

Radar Roy:



__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurtleBoy View Post
He tries to draw people into inane arguments, some weird pastime of his.
Appreciate 0
      07-26-2014, 01:24 AM   #22
GrussGott
Lieutenant General
GrussGott's Avatar
United_States
18113
Rep
11,746
Posts

Drives: 2018 M4 Comp Indv
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Newport Beach

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
I'm not trying to be a cheerleader for AL but the facts need to be set straight.
So why all the ALP / Roy wars then? I get that Roy's sells stuff but why not just include ALP in that set of stuff? I have all kinds of guesses about why but just wondering if you know the facts.

Also, are there shoot-outs like Roy's 2014 that would compare all of these as he did and then post the results? You had hinted at something like this but a link would be awesome.

thanks!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurtleBoy View Post
He tries to draw people into inane arguments, some weird pastime of his.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:08 AM.




f80post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST