[HenryHank]

My g/f has a 2009 335i convertible with the sport package. It has staggered wheels/tires -- it has 225/40/18 on the front, and 255/35/18 on the rear. I don't know for sure, but for now, I am assuming all four wheels are the same size.

She has been taking it to the local dealer (BMW of Greenwich, CT) to have her winter/summer wheels/tires swapped each season. This morning before she left on a long trip (about 300 miles each way), I went out to check her tire pressures. The fronts seemed a little high (39 psi) and the rears a little low (38 psi). The fronts should be 35psi and the rears 42psi.

Upon further review, apparently the dealer (BMW of Greenwich, CT) decided to rotate the wheels/tires, and put the rears on the front, and the fronts on the rear. We will deal with the dealer when she gets back in a week, but my really important question, is what are the risks of running this configuration during her trip? Is it unsafe? I understand it will handle differently, but she's not really a driver who will notice. I'm more concerned about her safety and any risks of damage to the car.

Thanks.

[Frenk]

Omfg

[BigFoig]

Wow....

[chdavis]

I had the same thing happen to me at Otto's BMW in West Chester, PA.

Thankfully, I noticed immediately upon walking out to my car and took it right back. My SA tried to guilt trip me with excuses but it's just unacceptable for a BMW dealership to make a mistake like that. If I wanted subpar tire service, I'd pay half the price and go to Tires Plus.

They did offer me one free hour of labor for future repairs as a peace offering, but they really should have taken it off my bill right then and there or given me an alignment for free.

[John 070]

Seriously.....the only way that could happen is a tech's son or daughter was allowed to help on bring your kid to school day....

The fronts are 8" and the rear 8.5" if I remember....

[John 070]

Originally Posted by chdavis

I had the same thing happen to me at Otto's BMW in West Chester, PA.

Thankfully, I noticed immediately upon walking out to my car and took it right back. My SA tried to guilt trip me with excuses but it's just unacceptable for a BMW dealership to make a mistake like that. If I wanted subpar tire service, I'd pay half the price and go to Tires Plus.

They did offer me one free hour of labor for future repairs as a peace offering, but they really should have taken it off my bill right then and there or given me an alignment for free.

McDonald's did the same for us yesterday, gave us a coupon for a free dollar menu item next time since they made us wait so long....

[fravel]

It should take all of 15 min to change them to where they're supposed to be. Just DIY and be done.

[AzureHaze]

Another stealership moment.

[NemesisX]

Originally Posted by John 070

McDonald's did the same for us yesterday, gave us a coupon for a free dollar menu item next time since they made us wait so long....

A week ago I went through a McDonald's drive thru and ordered a large drink ($1.08 with tax). I waited maybe 5 minutes behind a line of 4 or 5 cars and they gave me the drink free of charge as an apology for the "wait." I was pretty shocked! I didn't think twice about having to wait 5 measly minutes.

[sal_park]

Since no one else has answered:

yes it is unsafe, I would not drive it like that.

2 problems:

1) Rear wheels are 1/2 inch wider so you could have some contact with bodywork on the front. Not sure about this, but a possibility for sure.

2) Car will be massively oversteery now, and the dsc will not be expecting that. Fronts now have much more grip, rears have much less grip. When the is going round a corner, it will more likely lose traction at the back and try to spin. Hopefully your girlfriend won't end up backwards in a hedge, but that would be my greatest fear....

[sal_park]

Rears will be 12% down on grip, fronts will be 13% up on grip.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by chdavis

I had the same thing happen to me at Otto's BMW in West Chester, PA.

Thankfully, I noticed immediately upon walking out to my car and took it right back. My SA tried to guilt trip me with excuses but it's just unacceptable for a BMW dealership to make a mistake like that. If I wanted subpar tire service, I'd pay half the price and go to Tires Plus.

They did offer me one free hour of labor for future repairs as a peace offering, but they really should have taken it off my bill right then and there or given me an alignment for free.

Really, you expected a $250 alignment because some Tech incorrectly rotated the tires? Serious 1-st world problem.

[Efthreeoh]

Originally Posted by sal_park

Since no one else has answered:

yes it is unsafe, I would not drive it like that.

2 problems:

1) Rear wheels are 1/2 inch wider so you could have some contact with bodywork on the front. Not sure about this, but a possibility for sure.

2) Car will be massively oversteery now, and the dsc will not be expecting that. Fronts now have much more grip, rears have much less grip. When the is going round a corner, it will more likely lose traction at the back and try to spin. Hopefully your girlfriend won't end up backwards in a hedge, but that would be my greatest fear....

LOL. I went to a non-staggered setup long ago (like 230,000 miles ago) on my sport-package 325i and never noticed any ill-handling effects even at speeds well above the speed limit on some serious back-country roads I drive on everyday. LOL.

Maybe at 9 tenths on at the track, but at street speed I doubt the OP's girl friend would even notice; she obviously didn't when coming home from the dealership. If the tread pattern is not omnidirectional and the dealership kept the correct side-position of the tires, then I doubt it would cause any harm or have any DRASTIC ill-handling effect. Why not call the dealer this morning, tell them of the issue, have your girlfriend get them properly rotated on her trip and have the dealership compensated you for the $50.

[drewnel22]

Originally Posted by sal_park

Since no one else has answered:

yes it is unsafe, I would not drive it like that.

2 problems:

1) Rear wheels are 1/2 inch wider so you could have some contact with bodywork on the front. Not sure about this, but a possibility for sure.

2) Car will be massively oversteery now, and the dsc will not be expecting that. Fronts now have much more grip, rears have much less grip. When the is going round a corner, it will more likely lose traction at the back and try to spin. Hopefully your girlfriend won't end up backwards in a hedge, but that would be my greatest fear....

No it would not make that big of a difference. Tread compounds are the same and makes a bigger difference than the size.

[bender rodriguez]

Originally Posted by Efthreeoh

LOL. I went to a non-staggered setup long ago (like 230,000 miles ago) on my sport-package 325i and never noticed any ill-handling effects even at speeds well above the speed limit on some serious back-country roads I drive on everyday. LOL.

Maybe at 9 tenths on at the track, but at street speed I doubt the OP's girl friend would even notice; she obviously didn't when coming home from the dealership. If the tread pattern is not omnidirectional and the dealership kept the correct side-position of the tires, then I doubt it would cause any harm or have any DRASTIC ill-handling effect. Why not call the dealer this morning, tell them of the issue, have your girlfriend get them properly rotated on her trip and have the dealership compensated you for the $50.

I bought my car and it had a sports package but square setup. When I got my tires changed they put one of the wider wheels up front because they didn't know I had a staggered package with square tires. The computer most these places use don't count for the sports package or they don't know what sports package looks like so they always select the default.

Anyways I didn't notice they had the wrong size until I changed my control arms with stiffer HD's. Then my car started to vibrate and I took it to have roadforce. Firestone didn't notice the tires were on the wrong spot. Told me everything was fine. So I thought it was the tires. I got new tires and Costco put the wheels in the wrong spot too!!!.. I had to take it to an indy and be like look, everyone keeps telling me nothing is wrong but the car vibrates at 70mph. They balance the tires and said yeah you had the wheels in the wrong spot.

So for almost 2 years my tires were in the wrong spot and no one could tell.

[HenryHank]

Thanks for everyones' responses.

Originally Posted by fravel

It should take all of 15 min to change them to where they're supposed to be. Just DIY and be done.

Sure, if I had a lift in my garage, which I don't. Also, she had to leave on a trip and had no time to swap the wheels early on the Sunday of a holiday weekend.

She was able to take her car today to a local tire place who also could not believe the dealership screwed this up -- charged her $10 to swap the rims around. No damage to the wheel wells.

We've been having a multitude of gross incompetence at this dealer (BMW of Greenwich, CT), and this is just another in a long string of major screw-ups for both of our cars (I have an E39 M5 and a 2010 Z4 I recently sold). Needless to say, we'll never be going back to this dealer again. My g/f has had an ongoing dialog with the customer service manager at this location, and just sent her (and BMWUSA) this note:

I just want you to know the latest, absolutely complete screw up that I have experienced with BMW of Greenwich as a result of my last service. I left this morning for my annual writing retreat upstate NY - a drive of over 300 miles. My boyfriend checked my tire pressure before the drive and noticed that when BMW of Greenwich switched my winter for summer wheels&tires, they put the front wheels on the rear and the rear wheels on the front. With it being Sunday of a holiday weekend and me having a tight schedule I couldn't do anything to rectify it today. Absolutely unbelievable, not to mention dangerous. He sent me this email, which I read when I stopped for at a rest stop.

With the wider (rear) tires in the front, the car is more likely to "oversteer" which means that the car may turn MORE sharply than you expect it to, and with narrower tires in the rear, the rear could break free (causing a spin) if it's raining or wet out and you need to turn sharply.

He has checked this on BMW forums he is on (he owns an M5 and has owned a Z4 in the recent past) and just texted me that the feedback he is getting is that “it is unconscionable that they would screw up something that simple.” Other comments from the forums: “Seriously…the only way that could happen is a tech’s son or daughter was allowed to help on bring your kid to work day” and “What a stupid idiot dealer."

Needless to say, I now have to interrupt my writing retreat to go to a tire place up here in ***** New York (there is no BMW dealership for over 100 miles, I already checked on the BMW website) and PAY for them to fix yet ANOTHER BMW of Greenwich screwup.

I will be in this week with my SUV to pick up my winter wheels&tires, which are currently being stored at your dealership, because there is no way in hell I am EVER going to risk my car or my life with your of shoddy, incompetent service department again. Not when even what should be a simple wheel change is too much for the dealership to manage properly and safely.

This litany of incompetence from a BMW dealership is just too incredible to be believed. Stealing from my car lack of communication, not fixing the things that I’ve sent my car in for on multiple occasions, keeping the car for a ridiculous period of time, not even starting work on the car on the appointed day and now this - seriously, I couldn’t make this stuff up and I get paid to write fiction for a living.

[John 070]

Originally Posted by John 070

McDonald's did the same for us yesterday, gave us a coupon for a free dollar menu item next time since they made us wait so long....

They are a total machine, know their markets, know their processes, and know what to do in each situation. Sometimes that little bit of nothing keeps customers.

I don't frequent Best Buy but I got a $100 gift card from work one XMAS. 3 years later I still have it and start to worry about losing it. Should I buy a 14' patch cable for $30? What can I get? Long story short, ended up with a iPad 4 because my wife got another 5% off with Visa. The bezel was lifting off right out of the box--being Apple, I envisioned being either accused of being a crybaby, or that I did it. The associate said are you kidding me, if I spent that kind of money I wouldn't want the bezel to be like that, and went and got me another.

I tried to go online and recognize this girl, but wouldn't you know that web page led to nowhere (typical)?

[John 070]

Originally Posted by HenryHank

Thanks for everyones' responses.


Sure, if I had a lift in my garage, which I don't. Also, she had to leave on a trip and had no time to swap the wheels early on the Sunday of a holiday weekend.

She was able to take her car today to a local tire place who also could not believe the dealership screwed this up -- charged her $10 to swap the rims around. No damage to the wheel wells.

We've been having a multitude of gross incompetence at this dealer (BMW of Greenwich, CT), and this is just another in a long string of major screw-ups for both of our cars (I have an E39 M5 and a 2010 Z4 I recently sold). Needless to say, we'll never be going back to this dealer again. My g/f has had an ongoing dialog with the customer service manager at this location, and just sent her (and BMWUSA) this note:

Doesn't that place charge like $160 for an oil change? I remember my friend kidding me that when I was paying $57.95 at an authorized dealership in NJ, his dealer did a much better job because they charged $160.

[HenryHank]

Originally Posted by John 070

Doesn't that place charge like $160 for an oil change? I remember my friend kidding me that when I was paying $57.95 at an authorized dealership in NJ, his dealer did a much better job because they charged $160.

Probably. They're very expensive, but as far as I recall, most BMW dealers charge >$150 for an oil change, that's nothing new.

[gds52]

I think for normal driving the main concern could be the rubbing.
Its good your gf got it fixed.
I still cant believe they can commit such a blunder.