[Fear-Mongrel]

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

Do you 6 MT owners feel that the auto rev takes away from the experience. I drove a M2 manual with rev match and I found myself fighting with it. I suppose you get used to it after awhile but my initial impression was frustration.

Very first day of delivery, I didn't like rev match, wanted it gone. Even turned off DSC completely to make it stop, until wife kindly reminded that I only had about 2 hours of seat time and should maybe turn DSC back on.

But by day 3 or 4 I forgot about it, except where it worked to my benefit. Not having to think as much about engine speed, or whether I was too far into the entry of a curve for the gear I wanted to downshift to, let me focus more on the line I wanted to take and be in the gear I wanted for the exit even if I was a little late getting to that downshift. By end of trip, rev-match was a non-issue.

There was only one time on the trip I questioned the 6MT vs. DCT. We caught traffic coming out of Imst, and knew we were cutting it close for the ED drop-off in Munich, so we're on the highway trying to make time and sitting steady at 100mph (that's the level our ED gal told us not to eclipse...I think) and at that engine speed I was thinking that if we'd had a DCT we'd be 400-600 rpm lower with the extra gear. If we lived in Europe and knew we'd be spending a lot of time over 100mph, the DCT would be more tempting for quiet-er cruising.

Otherwise, the 6MT in the M2 is a joy to use. Reverse is a bear on day 1, after that either it "breaks in" or I found the sweet spot. Every gear is silky smooth. And the car can be so docile when you need it to be. We drove through plenty of little villages where we had children playing, lots of foot traffic, and we needed to crawl through town and I had it in 2nd and I'm thinking it's going to labor and force a downshift but it never did. It's not only easy to drive the car like your hair is on fire, it's an easy transmission when you can't get above 10mph and need the car to be calm and low-effort.

And the quiet cruising DCT question only occurred to us at high speed. At anything below 85mph, the car is shockingly quiet and serene - this was probably our biggest surprise. Maybe I'd read too many forum threads, but I expected it to be a noisy disaster, and it's anything but. So the whole wondering about DCT and the extra gear making it quieter thing went out the window. The 6MT is plenty quiet and great for cruising, and we didn't even think about road noise until we were doing 100.

The 6MT vs. DCT is a personal thing, highly dependent on how you'll use it and where you live, but I can say that the 6MT transmission itself is easy to recommend, as manuals go.

(BTW...the M2 is an INSANELY good car, and now we're counting hours until ours arrives stateside, so I'm hanging out here with you Competition folks just trying to get my daily M2 fix. Hope you don't mind.)

[Skulinex]

My personal experience coming from smg, 6 manual and dct is the power increase from these cars in every generation and how much more attention and concentration you gotta keep to drive it enthusiastically without losing it. I grew up driving manuals and still love it -my E46 still my fav- but i love going on mountain drives and -at least around here in North GA- they can be pretty hairy sometimes. These roads will teach you a lesson or two about your knowledge of driving skills lol. Once I took my M3 with the DCT, which I got Bc of a good deal rather than I WANTING a DCT, and it was very surprising how it acts -reacts?- with your driving style and keeping that engine at the right power band. Now given that the M2 is about the size of an E46, I might end up getting it in manual

[Al1969]

Current DCT, no plan to change

[HammerDahn]

6MT to 6MT

If I lived in an area with more wide open roads I'd get the DCT (and an M3) for the extra gear. It's def tempting but getting a clean 1st to 2nd shift coming out of a bend is so satisfying. Also If was tracking the car more I'd go with DCT. I believe you drive faster with DCT on public roads just because you're not as involved. 6MT is much more fun when driving anything under 8/10ths.

[Smindustries]

I have a DCT M2 and coming from PDK, the DCT is absolute, unmitigated shit. It's the worst one I've ever had in a car, and even the 722.9 automatic in my E63 was better.

I've had the car less than a month and I've already started looking for a replacement to hold me over for a few months until my manual Competition arrives. The DCT makes me not want to drive the car.

[AlpsRider]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

I have a DCT M2 and coming from PDK, the DCT is absolute, unmitigated shit. It's the worst one I've ever had in a car, and even the 722.9 automatic in my E63 was better.

I've had the car less than a month and I've already started looking for a replacement to hold me over for a few months until my manual Competition arrives. The DCT makes me not want to drive the car.

How do you feel it performs if you use strictly manual mode?

[alscks0414]

6MT for M2 and M3/4 segments all the way.
If I am getting more GT-like M5, I would go for 8-speeed automatic (and they dont offer 6MT anyways).

But problem is I am only limited to purchase 4 door sedan now and have to teach my wife 6MT with my new purchase if I am getting one. That is my rule in the house written by the ruler, the queen of the household.

[Smindustries]

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

How do you feel it performs if you use strictly manual mode?

Manual mode is my biggest complaint. For example, if I'm coming around a corner and traffic is stopped and I downshift to engine brake, then come to a stop, the vehicle remains in manual mode. PDK is smart enough to know that if there is no manual input for eight seconds, the gearbox goes back into automatic mode, so when I pull off from a stop, I don't have to shift. With DCT, I have remember that I'm in manual mode, then reach over and bump the lever.

If I'm accelerating with DCT and I decide I want to upshift manually and the car does it a split second before I pull the lever, it still goes up a gear in response to my command. PDK realizes that my command was so close to its own decision that I intended to do the same thing it just did and ignores my command.

Porsche absolutely nailed the gearbox logic with PDK and is the gold standard in the industry. DCT is a clunky joke in comparison. If DCT is an indication of what they think is acceptable, I have low expectations of the Competition even in a manual.

The current M2 is my fourteenth BMW and all the others were manuals. I've always loved BMW manuals, however the whole rev-matching thing is a pisser.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

Manual mode is my biggest complaint. For example, if I'm coming around a corner and traffic is stopped and I downshift to engine brake, then come to a stop, the vehicle remains in manual mode. PDK is smart enough to know that if there is no manual input for eight seconds, the gearbox goes back into automatic mode, so when I pull off from a stop, I don't have to shift. With DCT, I have remember that I'm in manual mode, then reach over and bump the lever.

If I'm accelerating with DCT and I decide I want to upshift manually and the car does it a split second before I pull the lever, it still goes up a gear in response to my command. PDK realizes that my command was so close to its own decision that I intended to do the same thing it just did and ignores my command.

Porsche absolutely nailed the gearbox logic with PDK and is the gold standard in the industry. DCT is a clunky joke in comparison. If DCT is an indication of what they think is acceptable, I have low expectations of the Competition even in a manual.

The current M2 is my fourteenth BMW and all the others were manuals. I've always loved BMW manuals, however the whole rev-matching thing is a pisser.

Pdk reverts back to Auto after you choose a gear yourself? that's fucking ridiculous! That would drive me crazy. I don't want it just doing things on its own if I'm picking my own gears. Porsche's logic sounds dumb.

[Smindustries]

Originally Posted by akkando

Pdk reverts back to Auto after you choose a gear yourself? that's fucking ridiculous! That would drive me crazy. I don't want it just doing things on its own if I'm picking my own gears. Porsche's logic sounds dumb.

PDK only does that if you pull a paddle while in automatic mode. If you're in manual mode, it makes no gear changes for you.

Contrast that with DCT which thinks that pulling a paddle means you want to be in manual mode. That's aggravating. Pulling the paddle means I want to execute one shift, not every shift from then on.

[M-Pilot]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

Manual mode is my biggest complaint. For example, if I'm coming around a corner and traffic is stopped and I downshift to engine brake, then come to a stop, the vehicle remains in manual mode. PDK is smart enough to know that if there is no manual input for eight seconds, the gearbox goes back into automatic mode, so when I pull off from a stop, I don't have to shift. With DCT, I have remember that I'm in manual mode, then reach over and bump the lever.

I don't own a DCT but what PDK does in the above scenario is something I definitely would not want. If I'm in manual mode, I'm in manual mode, period. I wouldn't want the transmission to switch to auto after certain amount of time with no manual input.

[AlpsRider]

As long as the DCT doesn't stay in say 3rd gear after you stop.

[Mavus]

DCT logic by BMW M:

[Smindustries]

Originally Posted by cntzl

I don't own a DCT but what PDK does in the above scenario is something I definitely would not want. If I'm in manual mode, I'm in manual mode, period. I wouldn't want the transmission to switch to auto after certain amount of time with no manual input.

Perhaps I wasn't clear enough. DCT changes its mode to manual when a paddle is pulled. I don't necessarily want to be in manual just because I make a single gear selection. If I want to be in manual mode, I should have to move the console lever into position.

PDK doesn't flip itself to manual mode when making one gear selection. Moving into manual mode requires moving the console lever.

With PDK the console lever determines mode and the paddles execute shifts. With DCT the console lever determines mode and the paddles determine mode. That's stupid.

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

As long as the DCT doesn't stay in say 3rd gear after you stop.

They all go to first when coming to a stop, though I seem to recall my Turbo S starting in second sometimes, but I may not be remembering that correctly.

[IncredibleNewt]

Originally Posted by Poochie

The $2,900 up-charge for the DCT sealed my decision, manual is free..

Exactly. I'm in the same place. With the $4,000 price increase over the regular M2, and the DCT being another $2,900, it's been decided for me. I will be ordering with a MT.

[ChrisK]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

PDK only does that if you pull a paddle while in automatic mode. If you're in manual mode, it makes no gear changes for you.

Contrast that with DCT which thinks that pulling a paddle means you want to be in manual mode. That's aggravating. Pulling the paddle means I want to execute one shift, not every shift from then on.

First, I currently drive a P car with PDK and have "had" DCT in two M cars (M3/M2).

I don't think there is anything wrong with how DCT works, the PDK on the other hand acts more like an actual automatic transmission with paddles. imho

The simple solution is go with a MT and code out Rev-Matching.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

With PDK the console lever determines mode and the paddles execute shifts. With DCT the console lever determines mode and the paddles determine mode. That's stupid.

It's more convenient if you want to switch to manual mode to just pull a paddle than to mess around with switching levers from side to side. This rarely comes up for me as I generally just start in manual mode and stick with it. The exception is if I am in stop and go traffic for a long enough period of time to decide to switch it to auto. Then when traffic clears I choose a gear and auto is off, how I like it.

The one thing that is annoying is if you choose a gear and the car was about to choose a gear to avoid stalling and it double down shifts spiking revs like crazy.... but I guess it's doing what I tell it to do, I asked for a down shift, and it did it even though it had decided to do a split second before when revs were very low. I can see the opposite being annoying though as well, you go for a down shift that you actually want and it doesn't because it already down shifted shortly before you did.

[Smindustries]

Originally Posted by ChrisK

First, I currently drive a P car with PDK and have "had" DCT in two M cars (M3/M2).

I don't think there is anything wrong with how DCT works, the PDK on the other hand acts more like an actual automatic transmission with paddles. imho

The simple solution is go with a MT and code out Rev-Matching.

I agree with you about PDK. It’s an excellent automatic when you want it to be an automatic. The DCT is a a good sequential when you want it to be an automatic.

I also have a PDK vehicle and every time I pull into the garage and park it next to the M2, I think, ‘Man, this is a good gearbox compared to that turd.’ In fact, I often marvel at how good the Macan Turbo is compared to the M2. It’s equal or better at everything except burnouts and the cost of entry, but that’s a matter for a separate thread.

[Duck Sauce]

I keep bouncing between DCT and MT. All my performance cars have only been MT. Whenever we own a car with paddle shifters I say "let's use manual mode and make it more fun" inevitably I never use them and the experience is way more detached. $2900 for a gearbox choice doesn't really factor for me. Most of my use will be casual and for fun but it'll see some commute work too. I'll be sticking with MT I think.

But whenever I see someone's interior with a V2 wheel and long carbon shifters

[Sideshow]

Its the same transmission as the OG right? Will it still need this?

http://www.burgertuning.com/clutch_stop_BMW.html

[randyt]

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

Do you 6 MT owners feel that the auto rev takes away from the experience. I drove a M2 manual with rev match and I found myself fighting with it. I suppose you get used to it after awhile but my initial impression was frustration.

I have to admit that it took me several hundred miles to stop trying to match revs on mine. There were times after that that old habits would still interfere but it seemed to be getting more normal.

[Romo]

M2 6MT now, M2C DCT for sure given the outrageous CO2 taxes in the Netherlands. The MT wil be €8-10K more compared to DCT

My current M2 MT had already a €6K bump on price, wel that was once, but not the next time.

I do like the MT gearbox as it is smooth (no rubbery at al like some do experience ) I do not like the clutch as it is light, engages very late with almost no feel to it.

I have also driven PDK with my former 981 CGTS, it was something out of the ordinary IMHO, what a box, fast, crisp, intuitive, all my cars before this one where MT`s, but I`ve to admit I fell in love with the PDK. Just brilliant.