[luca10]

Figured I'd start a new thread once all the work was done and share my experience. So this week I flashed my car from bootmod3 stage 2 to stage 2+ 93 along with
- b58tu hpfp
- vrsf charge pipe
- h&r sport springs
- xdelete flash

Already on the car was
- Armytrix exhaust
- vrsf catless downpipes
- agency power cold are intake

Going from stage 2 to stage 2+ is noticeable but not as big of difference as I thought there would be. Power band/boost is smooth, I'd say you feel the torque more but once the torque lets out there's not a big difference with the top end hp. If anyone else did stage2+ let me know if you feel the same way.

The springs feel better, more planted to the ground but not as rough as I would like, a bit bouncy. As far as the drop, it's perfect, not too low but just perfect.

And the xdelete has been fun for sure. Have not gone back to xdrive yet, do not want to flash too many times and no need to have xdrive now until the snow comes in the winter but it feels good and the flash was very simple, took only a few minutes.

Here is a 75-120mph pull with stage 2+ and a quick little demonstration of the xdelete

[IMS-340C]

Nice, can you make a comparison in acceleration with and without X delete when you have the time ? Thanks

Originally Posted by luca10

Figured I'd start a new thread once all the work was done and share my experience. So this week I flashed my car from bootmod3 stage 2 to stage 2+ 93 along with
- b58tu hpfp
- vrsf charge pipe
- h&r sport springs
- xdelete flash

Already on the car was
- Armytrix exhaust
- vrsf catless downpipes
- agency power cold are intake

Going from stage 2 to stage 2+ is noticeable but not as big of difference as I thought there would be. Power band/boost is smooth, I'd say you feel the torque more but once the torque lets out there's not a big difference with the top end hp. If anyone else did stage2+ let me know if you feel the same way.

The springs feel better, more planted to the ground but not as rough as I would like, a bit bouncy. As far as the drop, it's perfect, not too low but just perfect.

And the xdelete has been fun for sure. Have not gone back to xdrive yet, do not want to flash too many times and no need to have xdrive now until the snow comes in the winter but it feels good and the flash was very simple, took only a few minutes.

Here is a 75-120mph pull with stage 2+ and a quick little demonstration of the xdelete

[luca10]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

Nice, can you make a comparison in acceleration with and without X delete when you have the time ? Thanks

Are you looking for a 0-60 or doesn't matter. Someone posted recently that they did a hard start with launch control with their xdrive and ruined their transfer case.

When I turn xdrive back on I can get a 40-80 pull but will probably stay away from 0mph launches

[IMS-340C]

No of course not 0-60 the xdrive will crush the X delete for sure.

I am looking for Dragy rolling speeds 100-200 Km/h or 60-130 mph or lower speeds.

Would be interesting to know how much the Xdrive is losing to the RWD.

Originally Posted by luca10

Are you looking for a 0-60 or doesn't matter. Someone posted recently that they did a hard start with launch control with their xdrive and ruined their transfer case.

When I turn xdrive back on I can get a 40-80 pull but will probably stay away from 0mph launches

[luca10]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

No of course not 0-60 the xdrive will crush the X delete for sure.

I am looking for Dragy rolling speeds 100-200 Km/h or 60-130 mph or lower speeds.

Would be interesting to know how much the Xdrive is losing to the RWD.

Sounds good! I will let you know once it's flashed back to xdrive!

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

No of course not 0-60 the xdrive will crush the X delete for sure.

I am looking for Dragy rolling speeds 100-200 Km/h or 60-130 mph or lower speeds.

Would be interesting to know how much the Xdrive is losing to the RWD.

Not sure if I'm reading the wrong thought train on this.......but switching X delete on/off will make zero difference to 100-200 times. The xdrive drivetrain drag is always there whether you turn it off or not.

[IMS-340C]

Doesn't the X delete disengage the front drive shafts ? that's less moving parts in the drivetrain and less drivetrain loss.

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Not sure if I'm reading the wrong thought train on this.......but switching X delete on/off will make zero difference to 100-200 times. The xdrive drivetrain drag is always there whether you turn it off or not.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

Doesn't the X delete disengage the front drive shafts ? that's less moving parts in the drivetrain and less drivetrain loss.

Technically it pulls the clutch pack to stop power being diverted to the front driveshafts.
But the front driveshafts, diff, prop shaft, etc is still all rotating whether driven by the engine or not.

At higher speeds the xDrive car has two disadvantages, the additional weight of the system and the increased rolling resistance. X delete does nothing to change that.

[IMS-340C]

All true but you missed one more crucial disadvantage the X delete helps with which is the the engine having to rotate more weight (front drive shafts) which consumes some of the engine power (more drivetrain loss)

Originally Posted by NISFAN

At higher speeds the xDrive car has two disadvantages, the additional weight of the system and the increased rolling resistance. X delete does nothing to change that.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

All true but you missed one more crucial disadvantage the X delete helps with which is the the engine having to rotate more weight (front drive shafts) which consumes some of the engine power (more drivetrain loss)

You might think so but no it makes zero difference whether the engine is driving the front drivetrain or the road is. The fact is all the parts will be rotating at a given road speed regardless of whether torque is being added or not. The losses will be roughly the same.
Whilst you do get an increase in losses with more power, what you gain by not sending torque through the front driveshafts ends up being added to the rear. Swings and roundabouts.

[FLF30]

Pour yourself some E30 in the tank, there is a significant difference from 93.

[luca10]

Originally Posted by FLF30

Pour yourself some E30 in the tank, there is a significant difference from 93.

I would think stage 2 93 to stage 2+ 93 should have been a pretty significant change but I will try some e30!

[IMS-340C]

Maybe it won't matter as much if you are cruising.

But at full acceleration it's basics physics, the more weight the engine have to rotate the more power it loses.

Originally Posted by NISFAN

You might think so but no it makes zero difference whether the engine is driving the front drivetrain or the road is. The fact is all the parts will be rotating at a given road speed regardless of whether torque is being added or not. The losses will be roughly the same.
Whilst you do get an increase in losses with more power, what you gain by not sending torque through the front driveshafts ends up being added to the rear. Swings and roundabouts.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

Maybe it won't matter as much if you are cruising.

But at full acceleration it's basics physics, the more weight the engine have to rotate the more power it loses.

How is it turning less weight in RWD mode?

[IMS-340C]

Assuming one drive shaft weighs 25 Kgs then in case of RWD it's 25X2= 50 Kgs.
In case of xdrive you have 4 drive shafts, 25X4=100 Kgs.

Originally Posted by NISFAN

How is it turning less weight in RWD mode?

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

Assuming one drive shaft weighs 25 Kgs then in case of RWD it's 25X2= 50 Kgs.
In case of xdrive you have 4 drive shafts, 25X4=100 Kgs.

So you're saying the front driveshafts don't move when in xdelete?

[IMS-340C]

Of course they move with the car like the front wheels in a RWD car, but not using the engine power.

So assuming the same weights above in RWD the engine has to rotate 50 Kgs of drive shafts weight while in xDrive the engine has to rotate 100 Kgs of drive shafts weight.

Originally Posted by NISFAN

So you're saying the front driveshafts don't move when in xdelete?

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by IMS-340MP

Of course they move with the car like the front wheels in a RWD car, but not using the engine power.

So assuming the same weights above in RWD the engine has to rotate 50 Kgs of drive shafts weight while in xDrive the engine has to rotate 100 Kgs of drive shafts weight.

Ok, so if you accept that the front driveshafts rotate with the front wheels, and front and rear wheels will rotate at same rotational speeds, where does the energy come to drive them in xdelete mode? It's not free.

Answer is they are driven by the road, therefore increasing the drive drag on the chassis. I have to add the additional force to drive the extra drivetrain drag to the rear wheels to over come it. That is no more efficient than if I just powered the front driveshafts directly from the engine. In both cases both sets of prop-shafts and diffs will be rotating at exactly the same speeds.

The only way you get around this drag is if you fit freewheeling front hubs like some off roaders have.

In summary, an xDrive's 100-200 time is sure to be identical whether you run in xdelete mode or not.

[B58togo]

OP, throw in some ethanol and flash the Stage 2 + E30 map. It'll be a big difference.

[luca10]

Originally Posted by B58togo

OP, throw in some ethanol and flash the Stage 2 + E30 map. It'll be a big difference.

This is a really really noob question as I am still learning a lot, but to do the e30 flash, what would I need to do? I think I googled a few gas stations semi near by that have e85. Do I need to fill the tank up with e85, or 1/2 93 1/2 e85? I never fully understood

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by luca10

This is a really really noob question as I am still learning a lot, but to do the e30 flash, what would I need to do? I think I googled a few gas stations semi near by that have e85. Do I need to fill the tank up with e85, or 1/2 93 1/2 e85? I never fully understood

Just be careful with pump E fuels. They are not guaranteed to contain the stated ethanol content. Depending on location, E85 for example could have as little as 51% ethanol ( regulation range is 51-83%). Flex fuel vehicles can adapt to this range so it's not a problem and octane is way higher than those vehicles need. But as you 'need' the octane, you might not be getting what you think. That's why some mix their own, only guaranteed way to get what you need.

[luca10]

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Just be careful with pump E fuels. They are not guaranteed to contain the stated ethanol content. Depending on location, E85 for example could have as little as 51% ethanol ( regulation range is 51-83%). Flex fuel vehicles can adapt to this range so it's not a problem and octane is way higher than those vehicles need. But as you 'need' the octane, you might not be getting what you think. That's why some mix their own, only guaranteed way to get what you need.

Thanks, and where would I find some e85 of my own? Also, let's say our tanks our 15g, how much would you put if normal 93 and how much e85