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01-22-2015, 05:12 PM | #1 |
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Top 3 Reasons why you should not be doing NBT retrofit in E-series on your own
Top 3 Rreasons Why You Should Not Be Doing NBT Retrofit In E-Series On Your Own If you are a BMW enthusiast you must have seen the hype about the NBT retrofit for E-series. We have released our eNBT Retrofit Adapter for the NBT retrofit in early 2014 and have improved the eNBT Retrofit Adapter over the course of last year, so that now all features are supported* without any compromise or limitations. This includes E9x, E8x, E6x and E7x vehicles. If you would like to know more about the NBT retrofit, we recommend that you start with the following post: Comparison of CIC and NBT Retrofits in E-series Being the developer and pioneer of the NBT retrofit in E-series (not just reseller), we know this retrofit inside-out, like no one else. We receive far too many questions from customers running into issues when trying to tackle this retrofit on their own - the story is almost always the same: they got a very good "deal" on the NBT hardware, they spend some time getting all the required parts from various sources (sometimes at a very high price), they somehow managed to install the hardware, but now functionality is missing, features are not working, USB and Bluetooth do not respond, GPS does not show correct location, and the list goes on and on. We came up with a list of top 3 reasons why this retrofit should be left to the professionals and should not be attempted on your own (unless you are a BMW specialist or are in for some serious challenges): 1. SIGNALS, COMMANDS, COMMUNICATION PROTOCOLS.. AND WIRING, WIRING, WIRING On a complexity scale of 1-10, this retrofit is ranked number 7 or so. Unless your vehicle came from factory really empty (basically, 4 wheels and a steering wheel), this retrofit is complex and is not plug-and-play, no matter how you look at it. Proper installation of this retrofit requires understanding of BMW electrical system, MOST and CAN bus, and how various ECUs are wired together. You need to understand what you are doing and why you are doing it, in order to successfully get the NBT system to work in your vehicle. Even if you are handy and have done "similar" projects in the past, you need someone who will guide you through this retrofit from start to finish. 2. FINE-TUNING THE RETROFIT ON THE VEHICLE Correct installation of the NBT retrofit is only the tip of the iceberg. Think about it: you are taking the latest hardware and software from F-series, and putting it into an E-series vehicle (from 4-10 years back). It's like taking an Android OS, getting it to run on a 1999 Nokia phone and then getting this hybrid to charge from an Apple charger. The parts that you install must be correct parts, they must be properly prepared and coded. However, even correct parts do not guarantee that everything will run smoothly right after installation. This is due to the fact that ALL vehicles are configured differently, and it may as well be the case, that in order for NBT retrofit to work correctly in YOUR vehicle, some fine-tuning of the vehicle will be required. There is nothing scary about it, as long as you know what you are doing. But as a matter of fact very few people would actually know how to diagnose this and what to do in order to solve the issue. You need to have proper support from someone who truly understands this retrofit. 3. ADDITIONAL MECHANICAL ADAPTATION AND CUSTOMIZATION OF EQUIPMENT Somewhat related to point 1., but important enough to distinguish, is the fact that BMW never manufactured any NBT hardware specifically for E-series BMW. That's why mechanical adaptation and customization of the original BMW hardware is required in order for it to be installed into E-series BMWs. Specifically this concerns the head unit, fascia, front panel, display and center console trim/iDrive touch controller (if being used). Maybe easy for some to do, maybe more complex for others, but whatever the case, you need to understand what needs to be done before you start. CONCLUSION This post is not intended to deter you from pursuing this retrofit in any way. This retrofit is indeed the most modern and advanced retrofit that you can give your vehicle, but it does require some special skills, knowledge and understanding, if you are looking to do the NBT retrofit on your own. If you are looking to do the NBT retrofit on your own, despite the challenges, we can offer you one of our eNBT Retrofit Adapters and free PC utility for eNBT Retrofit Adapter configuring and coding specific options in NBT for proper operation of NBT in E-series. eNBT Retrofit Adapter is the integral part of the NBT retrofit, and is what makes the retrofit possible. If, however, you are looking for a simpler way to do the NBT retrofit in your E-series, we will be happy to offer the complete eNBT kit for your vehicle, which will include all the parts which you will need for the upgrade. We will serve as a "project manager" for you, and will oversee the retrofit for you from start to finish. We will be by your side throughout the conversion process no matter where you are and will always guide you in the right direction. I hope you found this post informative and it helps you understand better what the NBT retrofit in E-series entails. I would like to finish off with some humour, since sometimes it is one of the best ways to understand the reality. And, sadly, this is really the trend that we see these days: Conversation from online forum Original Post: "Hello all, I am a cardiac-surgeon with 20 years of experience, working at a hospital. Now I have a bit of spare time on my hands and looking to do some work on the side. Recently I downloaded ISTA D and bought ICOM ABC (Chinese copy). Over the past few months, I’ve read quite a bit of forums and did some coding on my BMW, and now I am thinking of offering my services to fellow BMW lovers. I am pretty familiar with coding of my 335i – things like video in motion and folding mirrors. Now I am thinking, what will I require to successfully offer this service? Maybe I should also download EDIABAS? Any coding tools you can recommend? Maybe Autologic or GAT HandHeld Coder will be a good choice? What else will I need? Thanks, Mark." Reply @ Mark: Hello Mark, I’ve worked as a mechanic at BMW for 20 years. Now I have a bit of spare time on my hands and looking to do some work on the side. Recently I purchased a surgical scalpel on eBay. Over the past few months, I successfully cut up my old leather couch, and almost slaughtered by dog, now I am thinking maybe I should start offering my services to other patients in need. Specifically, I am thinking about offering cardiac-surgeries in my spare time. I am pretty familiar with surgeries since I have extensive experience with manipulating can-opener. Now I am thinking, what will I require to successfully offer this service? Maybe I should get a lancet, Graspers, clamps, retractors? Any good sterilizers and needles/threads you can recommend? What else will I need? David. _______________ * At this time the only limitation which remains is HUD arrows and street names Last edited by bmwretrofit; 02-03-2015 at 04:30 PM.. |
01-23-2015, 04:59 PM | #2 |
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I still can't figure out how NBT is different than CIC. All the screenshots of features look the same to me, or at least the features I use in my CIC idrive are also featured in NBT.
Or is this upgrade more for people coming from a CCC idrive?
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01-24-2015, 03:55 PM | #3 |
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what is involved?
Can this retrofit be done on 2011 X6M E71? What is involved? Will it have factory look once completed? What is the cost involved? Parts, labor, coding?
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01-25-2015, 02:50 PM | #4 |
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Not only that, you'd be retrofitting old technology now that the NBT EVO is out
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01-26-2015, 12:34 PM | #5 | |
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Please check the following thread, which compares CIC against NBT retrofit: http://www.xbimmers.com/forums/showt...ght=comparison There are some features in NBT, which you will never get in CIC:
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01-26-2015, 12:38 PM | #6 | |
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Replacement of head unit, display and some rewiring will be required. The vehicle will have a factory look after the installation. Picture in the original post is from an E71 and everything looks OEM as you can see. Price of the complete kit will depend on your vehicle's configuration. If you would like a quote, please send an email to info@bimmerretrofit.com and include your vehicle's VIN, we will gladly let you know what you will need for this upgrade and price. |
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02-01-2015, 10:57 PM | #7 | |
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02-03-2015, 04:30 PM | #8 | |
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For E7x we supply NBT with 8.8” display that fits natively into the existing position – exactly what you see in the picture in the original post. |
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02-18-2015, 07:16 AM | #9 |
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I asked this in a previous post, which you conveniently chose not to answer. I will ask it again.
Has the HUD issue where navigational instructions are not displayed been sorted out yet?
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02-18-2015, 10:28 PM | #10 | |
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This functionality is expected to be added later. Sorry, if we've missed the original question. |
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07-04-2015, 02:11 AM | #11 | ||
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07-06-2015, 11:29 PM | #12 |
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On your website, in two of the videos, you are showing NBTs with 10.2” display installed in E70 or E71 BMW. Can you please post some close-up images of how exactly does it look like behind the display? Is it all covered? Looking like a factory-installed unit or does look like a home-made fix-up touch-up job, considering that E70 and E71 original display is only 8.8"
Last edited by igorbmwx6; 09-03-2016 at 08:17 PM.. |
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08-30-2016, 11:35 AM | #13 | |
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08-30-2016, 03:44 PM | #14 | |
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LOLOL. Priceless and right on the money!!!! |
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06-27-2018, 03:19 AM | #16 |
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I can't stay silent
I hate writing this. I'm a quiet, new BMW enthusiast with a love of my 2012 new to me car. I spent about 2.8k on this system to start. Spent about another $250 on top for unnecessary work as advised by support by BMW itself and I'm left with a cool looking retrofit without volume control. Yup Carplay is great, but when the volume knob wont work it loses it's charm.
I'll write another thread hoping for some expert on this site if they have any insight, but I wanted to post something that outlines my experience and current outcome so current prospective buyers can make an educated choice. Caveat Emptor and all that. So, I purchase this system back in March. As mentioned in the thread above, it was suggested a professional install but they will help if you chose to do so your self ...as per above "If, however, you are looking for a simpler way to do the NBT retrofit in your E-series, we will be happy to offer the complete eNBT kit for your vehicle, which will include all the parts which you will need for the upgrade. We will serve as a "project manager" for you, and will oversee the retrofit for you from start to finish. We will be by your side throughout the conversion process no matter where you are and will always guide you in the right direction." I pay and about 30 days later it arrives. I'm feeling nervous so I ask a local installer if they would install for me. The local installer warns me that they have experience with this company fixing non-working systems at the end of the attempted install and I should return it if possible. Well, based on the retrofit companies reassurance I decided to move forward myself. I follow very carefully the youtube instructions and the manual. If you are going ahead with this purchase if you PM me I can share some tips I learned along the way that aren't provided such as best way to fish the wires etc.. Installed and test run. Screen comes up and then dies. Everytime. They immediately accuse me of wiring things wrong, destroying the equipment and I am basically screwed. Well I feel bad. I must have fucked up despite being careful. So I ask what can I do? Andrew in support points out that perhaps the firmware is old on their NBT unit. I put on the new firmware and the system stays up..and well more occurs...I end up taking car to BMW for apparently unnecessary software update as my AMP may not work if the firmware is old...I didn't want them to have excuses to blame on me later so I did it. Fine....Get to the end of the install. No sound...expected. Put in MOST loop at combox location and viola I have sound but the volume knob on the panel doesn't work at all it just sort of stutters and you can see it on the screen. OK i still have to put the MOST loop in the HUD so I'm not worried as the rest of the system seems fine. Loop goes in and now the system has no sound again. Ask Andrew. I must have a bad panel. hmmm ok. Maybe I broke it so I reverse install everything again back to OEM. Panel works great. Everything works just fine. reinstall everything again...same problem. This is where I get a little pissed..maybe I'm being unreasonable. I contact one of their recommended installers. They are similarly confused by the problem. Andrew suggests I buy a new panel. Wait my panel is fine on OEM equipment. I hesitate to take that option. Andrew suggests that I go and take apart the MOST bus. Wait, that isn't what the manual suggests, it also isn't simple connectors and it would destroy as far as I can tell the MOST ring system in the car which I need for my aftermarket stereo goals. Andrew suggests I mail them my panel and the eNBT and go without my car functioning for a few weeks. Um no. Andrew suggests I can drive for 12 hours and have them reinstall and pay more. Um really? this doesn't sound like the company above does it? So now, I am gonna bend the knee sotta speak and ask for help here and hope some enthusiast has an idea. And I will call that company that says they fix this shit ( full disclosure they sell competing option which I wish had originally gone with now) and pay them a few bucks if they can fix this. What really pisses me off I guess is that Andrew blamed me for destroying my car when the screen went dark. From email " With only display to NBT Evo and pnp cable connected between Evo and vehicle you should have system up and running with ignition ON. If this is not your case than you possibly connected something incorrectly or damaged your vehicle or product with incorrect connection." Turns out the box they sent me wasn't software compatible with my car without a firmware update. Fine. But don't blame the buyer when your shit isn't compatible. He then says it's my fault because I didn't go to BMW and have the software fully updated on my ecu's prior. Doesn't say that anywhere when you are buying the system. So here I am again. They are saying must have done something again. Must be broken panel..but it works fine in OEM. According to Andrew: This is not right behavior. I suspect your panel is the problem. Maybe incompatibility with eNBT.....Wait you sold me a 3000 dollar system that isn't compatible with my stock facia panel? Oh and I love the defensive crap I'm getting from them now...from Andrew again " We do expect installation to be done by professional BMW shop. Sorry you have to follow our requirements if you want kit to work. We do not accept installation by customer and none of our videos are intent to let customer to install kit on his own, unless customer takes all risks related to equipment damage and warranty void." So now my warranty is void... Again not like the friendly tone in the ad above. I asked if he could get someone who has actually installed on the line. Nope...forget getting help from an engineer or an actual installer...he hasn't installed one before he says. WTF with this. Can you get help over the phone. Nope, they refuse. Can you please use black text in your replies? Nope needs to be in low contrast green so you can read it except in a dark room. I'm not kidding..can't make this crap up. So, the title of the thread was top 3 reasons why you shouldn't be doing an NBT retrofit on your own.... I think they should bump reason 1. You will spend 3k on a system..the full damn kit. Spend hours and days installing trying to get the damn thing to work. End up with a system that doesn't work and start seeing them duck and hide from helping. Thanks for listening.. |
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07-14-2018, 11:28 PM | #17 |
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Is E84 included?
I see that NBT or NBT EVO never been mounted into e84 series... But of we got its hardware like NBT HU, CID display, can We installed with your eNBT adaptor? |
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07-15-2018, 12:10 AM | #18 |
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I need to update this thread. I had a very successful end result once Vlad their chief engineer jumped in to help. He's excellent and restored my faith in their company and product.
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07-25-2018, 08:11 PM | #19 | |
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If you ever need to update the FRM (foot well module) you need the old system in. Not a big deal to swap but a very big deal if you don't have your old system. Just FYI |
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07-26-2018, 04:37 AM | #20 |
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Just curious; did their engineer jump in due to the negative thread(s)? Seems you had to "jump" thru hoops to finally get someone to fix your issues...
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07-26-2018, 07:18 AM | #21 | |
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I would have given them an A for customer service hence why I was surprised when I heard his story. At least in the end everything was righted but it should have never got to that stage in the first place. |
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07-26-2018, 08:26 AM | #22 |
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Well I think the influence of social mediums like this forum can't be underestimated in regards to consumer influence. I do believe that without the public exposure I may have been screwed.
Not because Vlad didn't care but because their initial support guy was so rude and incompetent. I specifically asked to speak to someone more familiar with the system...and he took it personally. I made this ask after he started making suggestions that would have caused real harm to the car. Pulling out the MOST hub was not a good suggestion! I think the product is excellent. I think the owners are excellent and Vlad. I think they need to address protocol with their one support guy who even went so far as to use light green text in all replies despite my begging for normal black because it was almost impossible to read. It started to feel like a petty attack on me because I questioned his advice. |
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