The Octane # Question

[falcon133]

Posting in this section because it affects engine performance, please do not complain that my post is mis-categorized.
So, I installed my JB4 yesterday and took it for a short drive last night. It was 19 degrees and I didn't push the car hard, but I got an idea of just how much difference the tune makes. It's a good thing . I really wanted to try map2, but all gas stations around where I live only carry 91(BMS recommends 93 for map2). So, I bought octane booster and ran map2 after I topped up the car with more 91 octAne booster. Was that a smart thing to do? Can a can of octane booster equal filling up with 93 at the pump? Can one just fill up with 87 and then add a 10 point octane booster and defacto run on 97? I know there are some learned people out there, please advise. Thank you in advance.

[Dackelone]

When you add one of those octane boosters... when they say "adds three points" they really mean it adds 0.3 octane points. Most octane boosters will add as much as a half a point (0.5 ) in octane.

So that means your 87 octane was boosted to 88 octane. Not enough me thinks to run more boost.

Dackel

[falcon133]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

When you add one of those octane boosters... when they say "adds three points" they really mean it adds 0.3 octane points. Most octane boosters will add as much as a half a point (0.5 ) in octane.

So that means your 87 octane was boosted to 88 octane. Not enough me thinks to run more boost.

Dackel

Not sure if you are right on this one. There is a horsepower 104 brand that says it will boost to virtual 104 octane. Obviously an exaggerated claim, but it tells me that they are not talking .1 increments.

[Cuz5150]

dont waste your money with those oct boosters.........If u need higher oct, this is the stuff to get. Its 114oct. Turbo engines love this, have used this the past 10yrs on my A4 1.8turbo. Also this stuff cleans the entire fuel system too.

[mineo77]

Originally Posted by falcon133

Not sure if you are right on this one. There is a horsepower 104 brand that says it will boost to virtual 104 octane. Obviously an exaggerated claim, but it tells me that they are not talking .1 increments.

octane boosters do nothing except make your gas even more expensive. You either run race gas, meth or both...no octane booster is gonna give you anything close. save your $$$ and dont buy that crap anymore.

[falcon133]

Originally Posted by Cuz5150

dont waste your money with those oct boosters.........If u need higher oct, this is the stuff to get. Its 114oct. Turbo engines love this, have used this the past 10yrs on my A4 1.8turbo. Also this stuff cleans the entire fuel system too.

I am all about cheap and effective solutions, but a paint thinner from Sherwin Williams? Lol

[mineo77]

Originally Posted by falcon133

I am all about cheap and effective solutions, but a paint thinner from Sherwin Williams? Lol

works better than those octane boosters, but I wouldnt do that either.

[ErvGotti]

You need to do more research on this before you start adding things to your fuel and running more boost that wil damage your engine.

First off the .1 increment increase on most octane boosters is true. The only bottle octane booster that work is NOS, Lucas, and Torco which will lead to a 1-3 oct point increase so 91 oct will yield 93-94. The down fall in this is that they use MMT as the main ingredient to boost octane and that has been shown to foul up plugs on various cars.

Secondly Toluene works. The thing is that you have to mix it up really well before you put it in the tank. Meaning that you cant just pour it in the tank then add gas then voila. You have to get a 5 gal gas can and mix it with the gas and shake it up really well, add a couple of oz of marvel mystery oil or lucas cylinder lubricant. A 1:10 gal ratio toluene to 93 oct gas will yeild about 96-97 oct.

"Toluene can be used as an octane booster in gasoline fuels used in internal combustion engines. Toluene at 86% by volume fueled all the turbo Formula 1 teams in the 1980s, first pioneered by the Honda team. The remaining 14% was a "filler" of n-heptane, to reduce the octane to meet Formula 1 fuel restrictions".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toluene

Toluene is already an ingredient in gasoline and most race gas mixtures run a higher percentage of it in their mixture. Though race gas is more fine tuned balance than we can ever make.

But do your self and you car a favor and get unleaded race gas if you plan on pushing more boost. Your car will thank you for it.

[mineo77]

Originally Posted by maxnix

Not if you like your seals or have any rubber in your fuel lines!

Hell, technically ethanol is an "octane booster" as it retards flash point, but it actually has less energy per unit volume so there is less power than 100% gasoline. Hmmmmmm........

agree, thats why i run meth and race gas when at higher boost on the track. otherwise i run 93 oct gas for my DD

[Cuz5150]

Originally Posted by falcon133

I am all about cheap and effective solutions, but a paint thinner from Sherwin Williams? Lol

Why LOL? read on please.............
http://www.elektro.com/~audi/audi/toluene.html

[falcon133]

Originally Posted by Cuz5150

Why LOL? read on please.............
http://www.elektro.com/~audi/audi/toluene.html

I am sure that totuene raises octain number and it works. My concern is the long term effect of introducing to an engine a chemical that was not meant for that specific purpose. Things like engine build up and spark plug damage come to mind.

[ErvGotti]

Originally Posted by falcon133

I am sure that totuene raises octain number and it works. My concern is the long term effect of introducing to an engine a chemical that was not meant for that specific purpose. Things like engine build up and spark plug damage come to mind.

Toluene is already in ALL comercial grade gasoline. Read the ingredients. MSDS's are a very good source for info.

http://www.jdm-inc.com/files/Gasolin...ventional).pdf

All your doing is increasing the amount of toluene in the gas. If your worried about build up and fouled plugs the can octane boosters with MMT is even worse. Google it you'll find articles on BMW, Chevy, ect forums of that stuff fouling up plugs.

And unlike E85 which was stated that has higher oct, but less energy per volume than 93 gas. Toluene is the opposite. It has a higher energy content per volume than gas.

Though get unleaded race gas. Let the experts get the toluene mixture right.

[BMW86]

Originally Posted by ErvGotti

You need to do more research on this before you start adding things to your fuel and running more boost that wil damage your engine.

First off the .1 increment increase on most octane boosters is true. The only bottle octane booster that work is NOS, Lucas, and Torco which will lead to a 1-3 oct point increase so 91 oct will yield 93-94. The down fall in this is that they use MMT as the main ingredient to boost octane and that has been shown to foul up plugs on various cars.

Secondly Toluene works. The thing is that you have to mix it up really well before you put it in the tank. Meaning that you cant just pour it in the tank then add gas then voila. You have to get a 5 gal gas can and mix it with the gas and shake it up really well, add a couple of oz of marvel mystery oil or lucas cylinder lubricant. A 1:10 gal ratio toluene to 93 oct gas will yeild about 96-97 oct.

"Toluene can be used as an octane booster in gasoline fuels used in internal combustion engines. Toluene at 86% by volume fueled all the turbo Formula 1 teams in the 1980s, first pioneered by the Honda team. The remaining 14% was a "filler" of n-heptane, to reduce the octane to meet Formula 1 fuel restrictions".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toluene

Toluene is already an ingredient in gasoline and most race gas mixtures run a higher percentage of it in their mixture. Though race gas is more fine tuned balance than we can ever make.

But do your self and you car a favor and get unleaded race gas if you plan on pushing more boost. Your car will thank you for it.

+ 1

This has been discussed before. Read these threads

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...octane+booster

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showt...octane+booster

[BerkTechnology]

When you start doing things to cheap out on fuel cost your are essentially cheaping out on safety measures designed to protect your engine.

I have done my share of using toluene as octane booster before but on less expensive cars that I wouldn't be heartbroken to pull the motor out.

On this BMW where a long block is $18,000 if you are in need of higher octane then buy proper race gas. One 5 gallon drum of VP MS109 is around $50 and is enough to blend about 3 full tanks of 91pump gas to get you to 93 octane the proper way.

Just saying.....

[BerkTechnology]

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=474350

I just did the math and it's better do buy race gas and blend it yourself vs. octane booster IMO.

[Jettafanatic]

Very Interesting read....
Love The Toluene bit... Agree with Berk that "safest possible" is using VP MS109 and blend ( that's what I do). Lead will screw up your O2 sensor, Cats ( if you still have them). The Octane Boosters will foul up your plugs eventually ( ran them in previous cars and removed plugs / used cylinder cam... pink residue on all and very bad running... Redline Took care of it after 3 bottles but still... ).
I like the idea of the Toluene + Lucas Cylinder lubricant... will have to try it ( easier to get Toluene than getting the VP MS109 for me... ) although to make it monetarily better should try to get a 55 G drum... anyone lend me a loading doc?

Cheers

[NihonX]

I prefer Xylene. I even run it around 40% at times. I haven't had a limp mode or knock yet.

My injectors are perfect still.

What rubber?