[RichReg]

Originally Posted by roburado

Right...but if the 330i will have an intake upgrade too, wouldn't they do the same kind of upgrade on the 325i? See what I mean? I guess it depends how different the 330 and 325 intakes are and what Dinan will do to them.

You're forgetting that even if Dinan makes something for the 330, it will in all likelihood not give the same output increase that it gives to the 325 (percentagewise). How can they possibly upgrade the 330's 3 Stage intake? Replace it? Doubtful. They'll just tweak the ECU settings for it, which won't do much. The Dinan engine upgrades to the E46 330, in sum total, did not boost the output as much as they boosted the E46 325's.

Dinan will probably have upgrades for the E90 325 that cost upwards of $3000, but I highly doubt that they'll create a 40 hp gain. Steve Dinan himself told most of his enthusiasts on several occasions that its getting more & more difficult to squeeze power out of BMW's engines as they progress from one generation to the next. This was right when Dinan upgrades for the E46 330 were released.

[blackE90]

you'll never get any of the money back you spent upgrading your car...

[maq]

Originally Posted by Ed_330i

BMW tuner, like Alpina.

BIG difference between the 2. Alpina started tuning and racing BMWs long before there was a BMW Motorsport, and today it is a manufacturer as someone pointed out. They build their cars based on selected BMW models in very small numbers.

Dinan is more like ACS in Germany, although Schnitzer is a manufacturer too and manages Motorsport's touring and endurance teams.

No offense to the Dinan diehards out there, but I wouldn't spend a penny on their parts. Here's a fact: Roundel has an article on Dinan or Dinan products literally every 2 months, yet if you attend a BMW CCA event, you will see none of their club racers has anything Dinan on their cars. And you will never see Mike Miller recommend any D products to anyone. Dinan products are IMO overpriced, overhyped and there are many other US-based tuners such as UUC, RE, AA, Turner, Technik etc that make stuff much better than Dinan's. Any of these tuners I mentioned is just as well established as Dinan is, if not better. Here's another fact: Sometimes Dinan just buys parts from others and re-badges them.

If you want a well tuned car, there are many specialists out there that can give you a much better result for a lot cheaper. Someone might point out that Dinan parts are backed by BMW dealers. Truth is, more than half of the dealers out there don't even know what the big D is. Not to mention the "lite" mods that Dinan makes like springs, exhaust, intake etc are the least likely kind of mods to cause a warranty issue.

[romeo26]

well i think thell make the the 325 with there own 3 stage intake and exaust that will probally be equal or more then the 330

[lux.sh]

roburado, while your logic does make sense, its faulty in a way.

Think of it this way. While Dinan have to work on tuning the 'detuned'
N52 engine found in 325i, they will also spend time on tuning
the already 'tuned' n52 found in 330i.

So, simply put it this way. While 330i owners are ready to start
with Dinan stage 2, 325i owners will step down and start from
stage 1 where it "retunes" your 'detuned n52' engine. Then you'll
need additional upgrades made for the 330i's N52 engine.

At the end, you will spend more money. So what 330i owners
paid for right now is NOT wasted at all.

Its not simple as just "slap on the parts" that 330i has, and go from there.
330i will always stay ahead because of its advantage of already
being tuned from the factory, and it just will require more tuning
from there for more power, while 325i will require more work then that in order to catch up to 330i.

I think you are confused with simplicity of differences between
the two, but take into matter that bmw is not that stupid.

If we knew all it takes is take intake tubing and exhaust manifold
from 330i, slap on 325i, bingo. There is your 30more hp?
I don't think so. Think of your logic one more, and see why
while it make sense, its not completely true.

If you don't understand, just wait and see what Dinan do.

Take example of a classic Honda case.

Honda's RSX Type-S and RSX Base model have exactly same
chassis, same engine, same everything. Just like us, Type-S model
is few grands more expensive because of "tuned" engine(but both
uses same K20A engine), leather seats and few more goodies.

However, in order for the RSX base to catch up to RSX-S, its not
simple as slap on same intake manifold and cams found in Type-S
engine into RSX Base engine and you are good to go.
Its not as simple as that. When factory designs two same engine
with two different output, its result of EXTENSIVE R&D, not just
some getto put-on-aftermarket-and-you-got-better-engine.

Thats why RSX base is ALWAYS behind RSX Type-S in terms of
engine tuning and performance of the engine.

This simple example is not quite identical, but shares same fundamentals and ideas of what we are trying to deal with here.

Originally Posted by loihisteve

I doubt Dinan will offer an attractively priced solution for the 330i N52, simply because BMW has already max'd-out the perf for that engine ... for the 325i N52, its a completely different story, and I consider it to be BMW's gift to the tuner world.

lol. No offense, but from that first paragraph made me realized
you are not very much into tuning.

What makes you think 330i N52 is maximazed tuned engine?
There is no "maxed-tuned" engine out of factory. All the factory
engines vary, yes, 325 is de-tuned version of 330i's N52. But
that doesn't mean its maximazed.

Every manufacturer take account into something called "Reliability"
which always restricts "max performance", which requires much
faster wear and tear. There is ALWAYS tunability available for
factory engine.

Example, honda's world-famous 4cylinder engine from S2000(F22).
F-series engines are pretty much "hardcore-tuned" from the factory.
However, you can still gain power with more air/fuel ratio tuning,
exhaust/intake tuning(manifolds tuning), or engine internal tuning
(even though F22 engine is pretty heavily tuned for performance,
there is still room for more improvement), or even forced induction
tuning.

You can always get more horses out of 330i's N52, higher the
compression ratio by adding more durable and strengthend pistons,
rings, internals, etc, better exhaustion system, better induction
system, engine data tuning, etc.

[lux.sh]

Originally Posted by romeo26

well i think thell make the the 325 with there own 3 stage intake and exaust that will probally be equal or more then the 330

yeah and dinan's own 3 stage intake/exhaust combo for 330i will smoke the 325. Now what?

[ZenDriver]

Having owned a Dinan E36 325i and a Dinan E36 M3, and having grown up only a couple of miles from Dinan's shop and having known Steve Dinan for a while...

Dinan products are overpriced, underperforming and some are shoddily engineered. The only advantage you get with Dinan is Dinan's bold statement about warranty coverage and that flies out the window once one learns about the Moss Magnusson act.

My Dinan 325 ended up on the dyno with a whopping 8 more BHP once I had the Dinan CAI, throttle body, exhaust manifolds, exhaust and chip installed- we're talking an easy $2500 worth of kit here and it gained me 8bhp. I had Jim Conforti do a custom chip for me and we got 25bhp out of the motor.

I am generally a fan of Dinan suspension setup philisophy and I think Dinan's suspension kits are pretty nice... That was till I had my front driver side spring snap in half at the top of the Cyclone on Thunderhill. Upon getting the whole mess back to Mountain View, Steve Dinan pronounced that the car was... and I quote... "Driven too hard."

Now, I can understand a spring snapping, but having "America's Premier BMW Tuner" tell a local CCA member that he drives his M3 too hard is sort of obscene. Of course I drive hard; that is why I bought an M3 and that is why I had an even higher performance suspension put on it. After lots of wrangling, Dinan eventually threw in a new suspension and re-welded the damaged shock tower.

I haven't dealt with Dinan in years but I've poked around their shop enough to tell you that there isn't any special sauce to Dinan other then a giant dose of marketing bullshit. 4 guys cramped in the back office and one guy who is an artist with a welder does not a hardcore automotove development house make.

If you want to make your car go faster, I have about a dozen better places for you to call.

[StewtheBassman]

Originally Posted by ZenDriver

Having owned a Dinan E36 325i and a Dinan E36 M3, and having grown up only a couple of miles from Dinan's shop and having known Steve Dinan for a while...

Dinan products are overpriced, underperforming and some are shoddily engineered. The only advantage you get with Dinan is Dinan's bold statement about warranty coverage and that flies out the window once one learns about the Moss Magnusson act.

My Dinan 325 ended up on the dyno with a whopping 8 more BHP once I had the Dinan CAI, throttle body, exhaust manifolds, exhaust and chip installed- we're talking an easy $2500 worth of kit here and it gained me 8bhp. I had Jim Conforti do a custom chip for me and we got 25bhp out of the motor.

I am generally a fan of Dinan suspension setup philisophy and I think Dinan's suspension kits are pretty nice... That was till I had my front driver side spring snap in half at the top of the Cyclone on Thunderhill. Upon getting the whole mess back to Mountain View, Steve Dinan pronounced that the car was... and I quote... "Driven too hard."

Now, I can understand a spring snapping, but having "America's Premier BMW Tuner" tell a local CCA member that he drives his M3 too hard is sort of obscene. Of course I drive hard; that is why I bought an M3 and that is why I had an even higher performance suspension put on it. After lots of wrangling, Dinan eventually threw in a new suspension and re-welded the damaged shock tower.

I haven't dealt with Dinan in years but I've poked around their shop enough to tell you that there isn't any special sauce to Dinan other then a giant dose of marketing bullshit. 4 guys cramped in the back office and one guy who is an artist with a welder does not a hardcore automotive development house make.

If you want to make your car go faster, I have about a dozen better places for you to call.

Good story ZenDriver, very interesting and revealing indeed!

My local shop was trying to ram $5k worth of Dinan upgrades into my e46 last December. I stuck to my guns and had him remove my CDV for $40.00.

If I want a more powerful car I"m not going to ruin a perfectly good 325. I'll buy a 330 or above once it (they) is/are available.

[zhpwantabee]

The DINAN Z4 on the latest Roundel was not even impressive. Better looking wheels, and only what...13 more horsepower from the DINAN intake? Psh...[/QUOTE]

I've been looking into Dinan for my 04' 330ci... It looks like a ZHP but its what is on the inside that counts. I asked about putting an Intake, Larger throttle body, Stage 3 Software and exhaust... The guy at Dinan said... "Uh I think you'll gain about 20 to 30 horses"

If I'm gonna spend close to 3 grand I want to get a more exact estimate... Plus My car doesn't have a warranty anymore... This means that Dinan will not warranty my car either.

Does anyone know of any other options than Dinan? They are very spendy... I think It would only be worth it if my car would be warrantied after.

[3002 tii]

you bumped a thread from 6 years ago, wtf?

first of all you have an e46, not an e90. while many of us are knowledgeable if you want technical answers specific to your car, you should hit up that fourm where you'll get mor responses, ie e46fanatics.

your 04 came with the m54 motor. few people have gone the supercharger route, ie vendors like Active Auto.

[c_jeong89]

damn i've seen people bump threads from 08 but damn 05!?!?! This was years before I was even a member lol. But if the guy ever comes back to check this thread I would suggest looking into the e46 AA supercharger for a serious upgrade.

[jaceaholic]

oh wow.. i love old threads that get bumped..

[AlpineSwift]

[Dr. G]

At least we know he used the search function?

[ArcticE90]

I understand your question. I agree, it would be very wasteful to get a 330 if you are planning to go this route