[gatorfast]

At $40k this looks like a winner. Seems like a much better value compared to the next trim $10k more expensive

[damnitBobby]

High marks on shifting action, ride quality, and steering feel. Seems like Nissan improved on the things that actually matter. As much as I was set on getting a 6MT Supra this is becoming a more difficult decision.

[supra93]

https://www.nissanzclub.com/forum/th...g-review.1151/

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

no free lunches in this world. if you got a heavy car its going to eat through consumables faster than a lighter car. if you're engine makes alot of power, its going to generate more heat as a byproduct (especially if its forced induction)

As you may remember I was cross shopping a near new PP2 vs a 997.2 with the stang allowing me to run 2 cars, rather than 3 as I could DD it. I rented a PP2 cab last summer, white on red, was REALLY impressed with it but yes, i felt the weight, really did. In the end I think for all the pros and cons of both cars, the weight was the difference maker.

[Alfisti]

Schwing on the engineer in that video.

[ASAP]

At face value... this looks like a car that is at best 5 years late. It doesn't offer anything say an M2 hasn't offered since 2016 lol... it also still rides on the older 370z chassis, uses the terrible nissan tech, an engine that doesn't seem to be particularly revamped and a 9 speed Benz tranny lol.

The Supra is at least BMW built and gets the best of almost everything. B58, ZF8, Idrive almost straight out of a BMW.

[wtwo3]

I think the big selling point for this Z is the starting price. It undercuts even the 2.0L supra which is pretty impressive.

Although... upon closer inspection, you can start to see how Nissan's able to offer it at a lower price point. SO MUCH PLASTIC. Plus super old tech - same platform as the previous Z - engine pulled from the Q50/Q60 - etc. I think the only development costs Nissan incurred may have been designing the exterior. Everything else is just parts bin.

That being said, I'm still glad they made it. We need more of these sports cars, and we need them to sell well.

[OkieSnuffBox]

Originally Posted by nicholasn

and anyway why would anyone get a Mustang (or Z, or now Supra) with an automatic?

As for the Mustang, a lot of those guys drag race. And the 10-spd box in those cars will hold MONSTER amounts of power reliably.

[gatorfast]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I think the big selling point for this Z is the starting price. It undercuts even the 2.0L supra which is pretty impressive.

Although... upon closer inspection, you can start to see how Nissan's able to offer it at a lower price point. SO MUCH PLASTIC. Plus super old tech - same platform as the previous Z - engine pulled from the Q50/Q60 - etc. I think the only development costs Nissan incurred may have been designing the exterior. Everything else is just parts bin.

That being said, I'm still glad they made it. We need more of these sports cars, and we need them to sell well.

Spot on. That's its main selling point - the value proposition. $40k for a 400hp rear drive manual sports car. I like how Nissan is marketing it too going all-in on the "fun" factor and not the performance figures.

[heavyD^2]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

Spot on. That's its main selling point - the value proposition. $40k for a 400hp rear drive manual sports car. I like how Nissan is marketing it too going all-in on the "fun" factor and not the performance figures.

The base car likely isn't going to be great on a track with the smaller brakes, tires, and open rear differential as it's a total stripper that doesn't even get the rev matching of the higher trim. Even the top spec is missing standard Supra equipment like HUD, wireless phone charging, dual zone climate control, etc. It seems to me that there's not really a lot of value at either price point unless you want to get a stripper and put $$$$ into converting it to a track car.

[M3WC]

Originally Posted by ASAP

At face value... this looks like a car that is at best 5 years late. It doesn't offer anything say an M2 hasn't offered since 2016 lol... it also still rides on the older 370z chassis, uses the terrible nissan tech, an engine that doesn't seem to be particularly revamped and a 9 speed Benz tranny lol.

The Supra is at least BMW built and gets the best of almost everything. B58, ZF8, Idrive almost straight out of a BMW.

Not a lot of manual rwd 400hp two-seat sports cars around for $40k.

Nissan is doing enthusiasts a favor offering this car.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

Supra equipment like HUD, wireless phone charging, dual zone climate control, etc.

I don't want any of that BS at any price point.

400HP, 4 wheels, modern reliability. I'd rip out the screen too if it didn't void the warranty.

[M3WC]

Originally Posted by wtwo3

I think the big selling point for this Z is the starting price. It undercuts even the 2.0L supra which is pretty impressive.

Exactly. The value is in the Sport trim for just under $40k.

Nissan built a cheap base version for owners who intend to mod for drifting or track work and versions for those who drive stock vehicles.

At least Nissan didn't put a sh!t 4-banger in the base model like Toyota.

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The base car likely isn't going to be great on a track with the smaller brakes, tires, and open rear differential as it's a total stripper that doesn't even get the rev matching of the higher trim. Even the top spec is missing standard Supra equipment like HUD, wireless phone charging, dual zone climate control, etc. It seems to me that there's not really a lot of value at either price point unless you want to get a stripper and put $$$$ into converting it to a track car.

That is exactly where the value is. Even at $40k the base model still has the 400hp twin turbo. The $10k up charge for Perf trim spent on the base, can produce a superior track car. Nismo Akabono brakes $1,800, fully built LSD $1400, Rays Gram Lights $1800, tires $1000, Coiliovers $2500... not even $10k. You are well on your way to a great track weapon.

If you are looking for a car with all the creature comforts you listed, I wouldn't even be looking at this vehicle. I'd wait for the rwd M240i.

[3798j]

I liked Jalopnik's First Drive review...
"Face it: You’re worried about the 2023 Nissan Z. You heard it’s nearly 200 pounds heavier than the 370Z."
"I need you to believe me here: The new Z does not feel 150-plus pounds heavier than the 370Z. It’s light on its feet. There’s a tiny smidge of body roll, just enough to give you an accurate sense of speed. The suspension settles immediately in a corner. It’s poised, confident. The steering — electric, unlike the 370Z’s hydro boost — is quick and precise. The car bounds into a turn, sharp and predictable."

The new Z? “It’s a dance partner,” Hiroshi Tamura told journalists at Nissan’s launch event in Las Vegas. “Gorgeous. Elegant. Not chasing numbers, only human feeling.”

https://jalopnik.com/the-2023-nissan...-at-1848929310

[Wheelwright]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The base car likely isn't going to be great on a track with the smaller brakes, tires, and open rear differential as it's a total stripper that doesn't even get the rev matching of the higher trim. Even the top spec is missing standard Supra equipment like HUD, wireless phone charging, dual zone climate control, etc. It seems to me that there's not really a lot of value at either price point unless you want to get a stripper and put $$$$ into converting it to a track car.

I agree, and as a person trying to replace my M235i I don't see this new Nissan as a definitive step forward, because in many areas it is inferior to my BMW, for example: it lacks fully electric seats with memory, has no adaptive suspension, no dual zone AC, etc. Supra 3.0 has all those missing items which makes it a more attractive and well-rounded potential replacement, without feeling that I take one step forward and two steps back. Too bad about Supra's tumorous fast & furious styling.

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by Wheelwright

for example: it lacks fully electric seats with memory, has no adaptive suspension, no dual zone AC, etc.

I'll grant you the suspension in a drivers car, the seats and the dual zone, seriously... who really needs that?

400hp. RWD. 40K.

[Wheelwright]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I'll grant you the suspension in a drivers car, the seats and the dual zone, seriously... who really needs that?

400hp. RWD. 40K.

If more than one person drives the same car, electric seats with memory linked to each driver's key are very useful. And I also usually set my temperature lower than my passenger to keep alert. But if you are the only one who drives this Nissan then I guess those features make little difference.

[Alfisti]

I will never understand the dual zone thing. IT'S A CAR, it'll jus mix and blend anyways.

[M3WC]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I will never understand the dual zone thing. IT'S A CAR, it'll jus mix and blend anyways.

I have had cars with 4-zone climate. Sh!t doesn't work, they still complain. "I'm too cold."

[billnchristy]

Wants: All this crap
Complains: when all this crap adds 500lb to the car

[G MONEY]

Originally Posted by M3WC

Not a lot of manual rwd 400hp two-seat sports cars around for $40k.

Nissan is doing enthusiasts a favor offering this car.

And it will be reliable AF!!!!!!!! Had a 91 300zx Turbo. Beat the shit out of. Never a problem. Had a 2003 350z with a supercharger, coils and not a single problem EVER!! My brothers GTR. Rock solid from day 1. Built to over 1200 at the wheels and it has been perfect. Can't say that about Audi, Merc and Beemers. It's a 2 seat sports car not a fucking cruiser. They will probably have a unlock ECU soon as well. Turn up the wick:-)

[Humdizzle]

i dont see the need for carplay, power seats, adaptive dampers, or dual zone AC. its a sports car. less weight the better. All i need is AC, good stereo with bluetooth, good drivetrain, good handling. the only thing powered i need is the windows.

yes the supra is overall better... but its 10k more.

compared to the 34k GR86 at the toyota dealer the base Z for 41k seems like a bargain. I'd just need to add the diff.