[abirmaher]

The more I think about it the more I'm seeing that it's lack of composure while pushing hard on back roads that may be somewhat bumpy and sometimes just lack of composure it feels like in those conditions. Also more body roll than I expect in general especially in sport +.

I'm hopefully that something like sway bars will help keep things feeling more planted in general but I'll probably end up doing that in August. So we shall see then if it helps.

[Bee Pee]

Originally Posted by th1rd3y3

The problem I'm seeing most of the time with many of the springs for these cars is they're designed for one thing. Looks. Look at the specs of the springs, if you can't find the spring rates, chances are they're only going to improve the looks. Sure it may "feel" like it handles better but in reality, I'd be surprised if it actually did.

Cheap coilovers are a great way to make you hate your car if you're daily driving it. I've played that game and once the "fun" wears off of "oooh new parts, car feels like a racecar!" and you have to spend hours on crappy roads with it, you'll very quickly regret it.

If you can't do it right, save until you can. Bilstein/KW/etc all cost more because they're worth more. Most of my friends thought I was insane when I spent $3600 on AST coilovers for my last car. Until they rode in the car, then they understood. The car handled amazingly but also wasn't punishing to commute with.

Sorry, I don't agree. Spring swap can work very well if you get your car setup properly, which you will definitely need with decent c/o suspension or else you are wasting your money.

I'm not talking about a $150 4 wheel alignment I'm talking more about a proper set up for example - http://www.centregravity.co.uk/

You invest a few hundred bucks and you will be amazed how much better the car feels, rides, steers ete etc.

[Bee Pee]

Originally Posted by abirmaher

The more I think about it the more I'm seeing that it's lack of composure while pushing hard on back roads that may be somewhat bumpy and sometimes just lack of composure it feels like in those conditions. Also more body roll than I expect in general especially in sport +.

I'm hopefully that something like sway bars will help keep things feeling more planted in general but I'll probably end up doing that in August. So we shall see then if it helps.

Is the lack of composure more from front or back ? If more towards the rear, you might want to try putting some ballast in the trunk to add more dead weight over rear axle. If composure is worse, then under damping more evident...

[th1rd3y3]

Originally Posted by Bee Pee

Sorry, I don't agree. Spring swap can work very well if you get your car setup properly, which you will definitely need with decent c/o suspension or else you are wasting your money.

I'm not talking about a $150 4 wheel alignment I'm talking more about a proper set up for example - http://www.centregravity.co.uk/

You invest a few hundred bucks and you will be amazed how much better the car feels, rides, steers ete etc.

I'm not saying swapping springs doesn't help in all cases. I'm saying that many of the springs marketed towards these cars (and most cars in general) seem to value form over function. Those springs will most certainly not improve anything.

[abirmaher]

Originally Posted by th1rd3y3

I'm not saying swapping springs doesn't help in all cases. I'm saying that many of the springs marketed towards these cars (and most cars in general) seem to value form over function. Those springs will most certainly not improve anything.

The H and R springs are supposedly engineered to help in both areas but I'm not an expert on this so I'm not sure.

[abirmaher]

Originally Posted by Bee Pee

Is the lack of composure more from front or back ? If more towards the rear, you might want to try putting some ballast in the trunk to add more dead weight over rear axle. If composure is worse, then under damping more evident...

I'll look into that.

[hoppy6698]

Originally Posted by th1rd3y3

The problem I'm seeing most of the time with many of the springs for these cars is they're designed for one thing. Looks. Look at the specs of the springs, if you can't find the spring rates, chances are they're only going to improve the looks. Sure it may "feel" like it handles better but in reality, I'd be surprised if it actually did.

Cheap coilovers are a great way to make you hate your car if you're daily driving it. I've played that game and once the "fun" wears off of "oooh new parts, car feels like a racecar!" and you have to spend hours on crappy roads with it, you'll very quickly regret it.

If you can't do it right, save until you can. Bilstein/KW/etc all cost more because they're worth more. Most of my friends thought I was insane when I spent $3600 on AST coilovers for my last car. Until they rode in the car, then they understood. The car handled amazingly but also wasn't punishing to commute with.

If you haven't actually run performance with the springs you can't knock them at the same time. Not sure if this is to help the OP (the reason forums exist) or to express an opinion you felt you needed to get out.

I believe this is also a copy/paste from another thread you posted on. Let's try to stick to helping the OP on his questions first.

[th1rd3y3]

Originally Posted by hoppy6698

If you haven't actually run performance with the springs you can't knock them at the same time. Not sure if this is to help the OP (the reason forums exist) or to express an opinion you felt you needed to get out.

I believe this is also a copy/paste from another thread you posted on. Let's try to stick to helping the OP on his questions first.

Given that he has the springs, and seems unhappy with them, I didn't think I was very far off on my assessment. No I've not driven this particular car with those springs, I'm basing my comment off of previous experience with both properly and improperly setup suspensions (springs, coilovers, dampers, etc).

He asked for opinions I gave mine. I didn't realize that my opinion was not welcome.

[hoppy6698]

Originally Posted by th1rd3y3

Given that he has the springs, and seems unhappy with them, I didn't think I was very far off on my assessment. No I've not driven this particular car with those springs, I'm basing my comment off of previous experience with both properly and improperly setup suspensions (springs, coilovers, dampers, etc).

He asked for opinions I gave mine. I didn't realize that my opinion was not welcome.

I never said opinions weren't welcome, but attempting to couch all springs as a 'looks only' endeavor is just flat out wrong. Any improperly installed experiences add no value either since this is a fault of the installer, not the equipment.

Based on the OPs issues, I do agree that what he may be looking for is something more akin to coilover setups. Sway bars would help, but the only way to eliminate any float from a platform will be through elimination of flex and rebound in corners. Air would be softer than race coils, but a racing coilover setup will be the only way to remove it completely. Not sure I would want to drive something that stiff, but it would work.

The high end coil sets like Bilstein PSS or KW V3s would at least allow the OP to dial in stiffness to personal liking.

[Blackcross]

Originally Posted by abirmaher

The more I think about it the more I'm seeing that it's lack of composure while pushing hard on back roads that may be somewhat bumpy and sometimes just lack of composure it feels like in those conditions. Also more body roll than I expect in general especially in sport +.

I'm hopefully that something like sway bars will help keep things feeling more planted in general but I'll probably end up doing that in August. So we shall see then if it helps.

Dampers/shocks control the suspension. Springs do not. Increase the rebound rate of the springs and you will have more composure. At least what I think you mean by composure over rough roads and weight transfer. BMW traditionally uses a stiff bump setting and a softer rebound setting. Since they don't have the crappy roads we do, they can get away with the stiffer initial "hit" on the suspension and thus have less need for control of the rebounding suspension. I prefer an initial softer hit and more control of the rebound.

Sway bars increase the effective spring rate when the suspension is under load: cornering, angled crossing over railway tracks etc.

Suspensions are a complex balance of front/rear spring rates, damper rebound/bump settings, geometry, tire pressures, front/rear sway bar settings.

Good luck with the mods and have some great drives!