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      02-06-2020, 02:36 PM   #89
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Just the opposite - the ones loving the 90's design started retiring and buying MBs...
It was about time to attract NEW fans (like myself). If BMW hadn't moved on, I would not be driving one now.
And I like the new 2 GC.
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      02-06-2020, 02:41 PM   #90
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I'd rent this from Hertz.
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      02-06-2020, 03:01 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmat View Post
Can understand everything but this drastic changes within series concepts..

Did people loved what we did with 1 series coupe? Let's kill it.

Did people loved what we did with 2 series coupe? Let's kill it.
Who killed what? The 2 series coupé is still produced and the only thing we know about the successor is that it will be RWD.
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      02-06-2020, 03:25 PM   #92
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Ouch!
Doesnt matter to me what you think of others. I've driven 4 rwd man bmws over last 12 years and now I'm changing it up. All that matters is what I think.
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      02-06-2020, 03:54 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanG View Post
It will be interesting to see who buys this car. Definitely not an enthusiast car.
BMW is officially out of the enthusiast segment. Drove the M2C last week as part of an invite event. Enough has been written on the car that I won't comment. Rather, the sales agent remarked that she just completed training to de-emphasize Ultimate Driving Machine. The current theme is Sheer Driving Pleasure. This is the preamble to full autonomy.

No more BMWs for me, thanks.
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      02-06-2020, 04:05 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Weiman View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmat View Post
Can understand everything but this drastic changes within series concepts..

Did people loved what we did with 1 series coupe? Let's kill it.

Did people loved what we did with 2 series coupe? Let's kill it.
Who killed what? The 2 series coupé is still produced and the only thing we know about the successor is that it will be RWD.
If you see any essence of the 1m or the m2 in the current 1 series or this new 2 series (coupes).. then yes.. concept survived..otherwise they've just killed it...

You may like it or dislike it, and that's great, but I just don't see any coherence between them.
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      02-06-2020, 04:39 PM   #95
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The back of it looks like a dodge dart
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      02-06-2020, 04:47 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmat View Post
If you see any essence of the 1m or the m2 in the current 1 series or this new 2 series (coupes).. then yes.. concept survived..otherwise they've just killed it...

You may like it or dislike it, and that's great, but I just don't see any coherence between them.
I ask again, what was killed? If you don't like the gran coupé, then get an M2 or M240i instead. Or does the addition of a new body style make the others worse somehow?
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      02-06-2020, 04:56 PM   #97
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I will never ever ever ever ever ever ever get used to that grille.
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      02-06-2020, 04:59 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanG View Post
It will be interesting to see who buys this car. Definitely not an enthusiast car.
I believe the target market are the A Class and A3/S3 customers first. Then people who want a 4 door BMW but similar in size to the E90. The price point is similar to the A Class and the A3, and honestly it's a pretty well equipped car even as a base model.
Also I dont think pictures do justice. You will have to see it in person.
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      02-06-2020, 08:10 PM   #99
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My gosh the 2 series gran coupe is so ugly...SOOOOO UGLY, what the hell were they thinking.
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      02-06-2020, 08:57 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Savageenterprise View Post
The back of it looks like a dodge dart
Not at all. The Dart's rear end looks much better and far more cohesive and proportionate. In fact, the entire Dart was designed very well. The lines flow well, it has many traditional BMW cues, like the Zicker line and the Hofmeister kink
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      02-06-2020, 11:56 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by phantom7835 View Post
How is this bmw adapting to world changes? If anything, that would make it electric. Changing a platform from RWD to FWD isn't adapting to any kind of change as a result of what's happening in the world
platform itself is related with X1, X2, 2 series Active Tourer and some of the Minis.. and this platform has an EV-ready architecture.. this is car is for competing Merc A, Audi A3 etc..

when you make a FWD car, you cut some expenses, gives you a chance to make the cabin more spacious (+3cm more legroom and probably more headroom) and better fuel economy.. most of the 1 series customers do care about the things above.. not performance etc.. they want a better cabin filled with electronics and fuel economy.. and most of them wont even know where to turn off ESP except sportier models..

so here is the catch.. this car will finance BMW to build more performance oriented models in the future.. and you re missing this point..
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      02-07-2020, 06:04 AM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yco View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom7835 View Post
How is this bmw adapting to world changes? If anything, that would make it electric. Changing a platform from RWD to FWD isn't adapting to any kind of change as a result of what's happening in the world
platform itself is related with X1, X2, 2 series Active Tourer and some of the Minis.. and this platform has an EV-ready architecture.. this is car is for competing Merc A, Audi A3 etc..

when you make a FWD car, you cut some expenses, gives you a chance to make the cabin more spacious (+3cm more legroom and probably more headroom) and better fuel economy.. most of the 1 series customers do care about the things above.. not performance etc.. they want a better cabin filled with electronics and fuel economy.. and most of them wont even know where to turn off ESP except sportier models..

so here is the catch.. this car will finance BMW to build more performance oriented models in the future.. and you re missing this point..
That's what people said about the OG X3, and it didn't happen. It just led to progressively boring and pointless crossovers and look where we are now. The only company that's managed to pull that off is Porsche. Every other company has succumbed to the crossover garbage craze
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      02-07-2020, 09:14 AM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom7835 View Post
That's what people said about the OG X3, and it didn't happen. It just led to progressively boring and pointless crossovers and look where we are now. The only company that's managed to pull that off is Porsche. Every other company has succumbed to the crossover garbage craze
And yet it's one of the hottest selling BMW, surpassing the 3 Series. "At least in the US Market". They have to produce these types of vehicles, that's what sells. I know it just boggles the enthusiast mind, but you have to look at the whole picture. They must do this, so they can cater to the enthusiasts which is a niche market.
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      02-07-2020, 09:19 AM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarlasaM View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom7835 View Post
That's what people said about the OG X3, and it didn't happen. It just led to progressively boring and pointless crossovers and look where we are now. The only company that's managed to pull that off is Porsche. Every other company has succumbed to the crossover garbage craze
And yet it's one of the hottest selling BMW, surpassing the 3 Series. "At least in the US Market". They have to produce these types of vehicles, that's what sells. I know it just boggles the enthusiast mind, but you have to look at the whole picture. They must do this, so they can cater to the enthusiasts which is a niche market.
There was a time barely a decade ago when nearly every BMW for sale could be considered an enthusiast car

What's left now? The M2 and the M3/4? And who knows how long those will last before the bean counters get their hands on them

The 1/2 series was awesome and they slit its throat to try to save mini
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      02-07-2020, 09:43 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom7835 View Post
There was a time barely a decade ago when nearly every BMW for sale could be considered an enthusiast car

What's left now? The M2 and the M3/4? And who knows how long those will last before the bean counters get their hands on them

The 1/2 series was awesome and they slit its throat to try to save mini
You are correct. But it was a decade ago, you have to move along with times. That type of philosophy won't work today. They have to appeal to the masses, so they can continue to offer vehicles like the M2, M3/M4. Companies have to adopt, and tailor there products to what the majority of people who buys there product want, that’s how they stay relevant. Or you end up like blackberry for example.
The newest trend are the EVs & autonomy, So now they have to adapt, research and develop the tech, so they can stay, competitive, relevant and stay in business.
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      02-08-2020, 02:26 AM   #106
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      02-08-2020, 01:29 PM   #107
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Hideous.. I bet it's a good car and all but I'd personally feel ashamed to drive it.. So it's not for me. If it's for you then go for it, I don't care.
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      02-09-2020, 02:51 PM   #108
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BMW accidentally built a CLA
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      02-09-2020, 03:55 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarlasaM View Post
You are correct. But it was a decade ago, you have to move along with times. That type of philosophy won't work today. They have to appeal to the masses, so they can continue to offer vehicles like the M2, M3/M4. Companies have to adopt, and tailor there products to what the majority of people who buys there product want, that’s how they stay relevant. Or you end up like blackberry for example.
The newest trend are the EVs & autonomy, So now they have to adapt, research and develop the tech, so they can stay, competitive, relevant and stay in business.
Well said.

Seems many an 'enthusiast' has missed where the market has moved to, diesel, SUV, and now in a state of turmoil, as the motor industry moves towards EV.

Also remember the 'enthusiast' is also going the way of the dinosaur. For many the performance car is no longer a priority in owning a BMW. The diesel 320d has proven that in many countries.

Strange thing, that some enthusiasts don't seem to grasp, other 'enthusiasts', (also valid opinions) don't want an M-car. They just don't fill the brief for many users. The M-performance range are a good compromise.

Cars like the new M135i & M235i GC sit there at the bottom of the M-performance range, more choice for those who are in that particular market.
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      02-09-2020, 06:45 PM   #110
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The color makes it look better, but "good looking" is very subjective.
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